What's the future of Juju?

[Nate Finch]

I wanted to specifically thank you for pointing out the bugs that affect
you. It's a huge help in prioritizing what we work on.



On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 5:24 PM, Merlijn Sebrechts <
merlijn.sebrechts at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks for your answer! I didn't know Windows and Centos support was
> coming so soon, great to know!
>
> The lacking documentation is the biggest issue to me. The charm-helpers
> documentation is outdated in a lot of places and that makes it seem as it
> isn't being actively maintained anymore. Ofcourse, this is a side-effect of
> a rapidly expanding product...
> The charm-helpers documentation also lacks some good examples and
> "guidelines". Things like "What's the best way to create templates, What's
> the easiest way to get relation data, ..". The documentation shows you how
> to do it in bash, but is really lacking for python. I had a really hard
> time trying to decipher how the services framework works exactly. Then
> again, this is probably also partly due to the fact that I'm still learning
> my way around python.
>
>
> As for the bugs. I submitted/"affects me" a few:
> Critical:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-deployer/+bug/1434458
>
> Medium:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/charm-tools/+bug/1433035
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1415176
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1429790
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1316174
>
> Feature request:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1432331
>
> The saltstack charm-helpers integration also has few problems. I just gave
> up on it and wrote the install hooks in python.
>
>
>
> 2015-03-25 21:32 GMT+01:00 Nate Finch <nate.finch at canonical.com>:
>
>> I'm a core dev on Juju, I can answer some, but not all of these
>> questions.
>>
>> First off, as far as long term commitment for Juju - Juju is a huge part
>> of Canonical's long term strategy... right up there with the Ubuntu Phone
>> and Ubuntu itself.  The Juju team has been expanding hugely in the last
>> couple years... I forget exactly the numbers we're at now, but it's an
>> order of magnitude more people working on Juju than there were just a
>> couple years ago.
>>
>> Juju is used *extensively* internally at Canonical.  We have a mandate
>> that all internal services be deployed via Juju.
>>
>> As far as supporting other operating systems, we actually do support
>> Windows, right now (though it can be a little tricky to set up, and
>> generally only works on private clouds, due to licensing restrictions on
>> distributing Windows images).  See here:
>> http://www.cloudbase.it/windows-with-juju-and-maas/   (Cloudbase
>> partnered with us to get Juju working with Windows)
>>
>> Cloudbase is also currently tackling CentOS support.  It currently works
>> and is just being cleaned up, it should be available for testing in a few
>> weeks.
>>
>> The number of features that have landed in the last year is tremendous -
>> high availability, networking, storage, major improvements in the GUI,
>> support for more clouds (Google Cloud Compute support is coming out with
>> 1.23, which is due any day now), Windows support, backup and restore....
>>
>> As for bugs, there are bugs in every product, especially new and rapidly
>> expanding products, like Juju.  If there are particular bugs that concern
>> you, we'd be happy to look into them.  We try to make sure that we fix
>> anything that is a regression or would majorly hinder usage.... we do use
>> this internally after all, so believe me, we hear about it when things
>> aren't working well! :)
>>
>> I'm sorry you find the documentation lacking. We have been putting effort
>> into that recently.  I, personally, am a big fan of extensive
>> documentation, and I know our documentation is not nearly as extensive as
>> it could be.
>>
>> I can't personally talk about big companies using Juju... I know we have
>> several very large companies doing very large installations, but I don't
>> think anything is public about that.  Hopefully someone else can bring up a
>> list of people using Juju.
>>
>> Hope that answers at least some of your questions.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 4:01 PM, Merlijn Sebrechts <
>> merlijn.sebrechts at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm interested in what the future of Juju is. From the small experience
>>> I've had with it, it seems like a product with a lot of potential. It fills
>>> a gap in our project that no other technology can fill. Its biggest
>>> strength is how relations between services are managed. This is something
>>> that, to my knowledge, does not exist in any tool today. It enables a very
>>> modular approach and solves a lot of problems we would have with other
>>> tools.
>>>
>>> However, I've also seen some things that worry me. Even after three
>>> years, there are still a lot of bugs in the project. The documentation is
>>> lacking, especially in the parts of Juju that are the most competitive. The
>>> community is also very small. The fact that it can still only manage Ubuntu
>>> servers worries me too. I could go more into detail here, but I don't think
>>> it is relevant to this question.
>>>
>>> I'm considering starting a big long-term project on top of Juju. The
>>> project would be very dependent on Juju, so I don't want to do this if
>>> there is a chance that Juju will be abandoned in 5 years...
>>>
>>> What can you tell me about the future of Juju? Things I'm interested in:
>>>
>>> - Big companies building services on top of Juju
>>>
>>> - Statements of long-term commitment from Canonical
>>>
>>> - Usage statistics
>>>
>>> - Statements of commitment to support other distro's
>>>
>>> - .. or else, signs that Juju doesn't have a bright future.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> --
>>> Juju mailing list
>>> Juju at lists.ubuntu.com
>>> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju
>>>
>>>
>>
>
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