positive socio-religious engineering!

sparkes sparkes at westmids.biz
Fri Jan 28 08:21:49 CST 2005

Emil Oppeln-Bronikowski wrote:
> Andy Stone wrote:
>> I came to Ubuntu for technical reasons
>  That's good, because it's a most important quality. :-)


snipped the human artwork debate

>> Children must not wear religious clothing to schools.
>  To be honest, I'm all up for that. Schools are place when I go to learn
> stuff.

I think the original poster was pointing to a recent case where a young
islamic girl was forbidden from wearing head to foot clothing.  I belive
she should have been allowed to wear tradional religious dress but I
think the local authority was thinking of how this ruling could have
been abused.  It's a dangerous president to outlaw any religious
iconography and dress hence the debate that surounded this girls case.

>  Also, I've been working in a ground school for year and a half. If
> people are alowed to dress whatever they like, poor kids are a target of
> joke,

I can state this certainly is the case.  I used to lecture at an inner
city college and saw it first hand.  But in most uk schools uniform is
compulsary until you enter post 16 education.  The young islamic girl
was attempting to get her clothing authorised as uniform.  It was after
all a sober headdress, loose blouse and a long skirt not that different
to what the school governers wished all young women wore to school.

The main reason given was safety.  I went to school with some muslim
girls back in the 80's who choose to wear clothing like this and they
had to change into different clothing for science, metalwork, some parts
of art and pe, the clothing was still somber but less loose and prone to
  accidents.  If the local authority at the center of this case allowed
such changes I doubt anyone would have heard of the case.

You wouldn't be allowed to take part in many school activities wearing a
loose rosary (for example) and compremise has been reached but
unfortunatly some people are so far up their own arses compremise is

>> rarely see my views represented,

I doubt unless you follow one of the worlds major religions in the most
average way anybody sees their views represented.  By not seeing your
views echoed exactly you can be sure you are an indvidual ;-)

>> and to be told other peoples beliefs
>> as though they were fact (Christ died for you, etc.)
>  Religions aren't based on facts. They are based on belives.

This is very true

"I refuse to prove I exist," said God, "for proof denies faith and
without faith, I am nothing."
The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy, Douglas Adams

>> Where I live snowdrops have appeared - the first sign of the returning
>> year. This seems fitting to me
>  Nice pagan analogy. :-)

As a very bad buddhist (ie an angry one who loves his laptop and a
steak) I talk to lots of different people about their beliefs.  I am
convinced that people are saying same things over and over again but
putting a different face on it.  There are no bad religions, they all
talk about being nice and helping your nieghbour and loving your planet.
  There are lots of bad religious people who are not nice, fight wars
and rape the planet.

Key to success in a multicultural society is acceptance.  Somebody might
have different opinions to you and you should accept them generally the
end result is the same, happy people, happy families, happy communities
and a happy planet.  The only problems come when peoples opinons
directly hurt other people, I have a great problem accepting facism for
example, this is where we need to be strongest.  Guide people without
directly attacking them (another way I am the world worst buddhist ;-) )

The snowdrops are looking wonderful outside my front window, and my
organic vegtable garden is still helping to feed my family, people know
they can knock on my door or email me for help and the ubuntu community
is made up of hundreds, no it's now thousands, of people like us.

It's a great community to be a part of because the technolgical elite
that sometimes form in online meritocracies do not interfer with the day
to day conversations and enlighten lesser mortals ;-)  The community has
become one giant gift culture and until I go off on one of my rants
about how I believe someone is compremising the community it'll stay
that way ;-)

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