kf5 5.7 utopic backports saga

[Harald Sitter]

On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 9:30 AM, Valorie Zimmerman
<valorie.zimmerman at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 12:21 AM, Harald Sitter <sitter at kde.org> wrote:
>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 9:01 AM, Valorie Zimmerman
>> <valorie.zimmerman at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 11:41 PM, Harald Sitter <sitter at kde.org> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 1:47 AM, Jonathan Riddell <jr at jriddell.org> wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, Mar 02, 2015 at 12:13:37AM -0800, Valorie Zimmerman wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, Feb 28, 2015 at 4:17 AM, Jonathan Riddell <jr at jriddell.org> wrote:
>>>>>> > writing the status here before we forget it..
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > scarlett kindy did the backports of kf5 into utopic using the kubuntu-ninjas
>>>>>> > PPA (after some faff failing to get the kubuntu-next/staging ppa to accept
>>>>>> > them)
>>>>>> > they were copied to kubuntu-ppa/next but then we had reports of them causing
>>>>>> > failed upgrades so they were deleted
>>>>>> > I tidied up the backport of kglobalaccel which was breaking the upgrades
>>>>>> > Now when I try to copy them over to kubuntu-ppa/next it complains there is
>>>>>> > already that version of the package in kubuntu-ppa/next even though there is
>>>>>> > not
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > if someone has the energy for it they can bump the version numbers in the
>>>>>> > packages in kubuntu-ninjas and get them all to compile again them copy them
>>>>>> > to kubuntu-ppa/next.  But i'm mostly out of energy for it :(
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Jonathan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are we actually supporting next and next-backports for 14.10? My
>>>>>> broken system makes it appear that we are not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I suggest that we remove the notice about those in the KDE wiki, and
>>>>>> suggest people either use one of the ISOs for 14.10 or install Beta 1
>>>>>> Vivid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've never had an upgrade leave me unable to login to KDE before. Not
>>>>>> a good experience. I know that the next and next-backports are testing
>>>>>> material, so I was fairly warned. But we've run out of time to support
>>>>>> them, so let's cut our losses and put our energy into Vivid.
>>>>>
>>>>> This sounds like a realistic idea to me.  We don't seem to have the
>>>>> energy needed for a kf5 backport, we've said there won't be an upgrade
>>>>> root for 14.10 plasma5 to 15.04, so we'd be perfectly ok it's just a
>>>>> tech preview and it won't get any better.
>>>>
>>>> how does one prevent the user from upgrading if they have next packages?
>>>>
>>>> HS
>>>
>>> The user will be unable to upgrade, if my experience is at all common.
>>> If there are no updates, they won't be tempted to, right?
>>
>> They will be able to upgrade to 15.04. It just will break their system.
>>
>>> We warned next users long ago that upgrade to 15.04 would not be
>>> supported.
>>
>> That's my point. We didn't. We warned people who read our web
>> resources (website, wiki wherever we put that information). If a user
>> got information on installing plasma5 from a third party they will
>> most certainly not have gotten this warning (in part because we
>> weren't pushing it a lot). In fact even if they used our board tools
>> (add-apt-repository) to add the PPA they would not have been informed
>> of the support status of the PPA as the description says nothing about
>> support [1].
>> So all those users know is that they re running plasma5. At some point
>> they'll be prompted to upgrade to 15.04 and then things will go boom
>> and the users will get pissed off and complain somewhere about the
>> shitty upgrade and then whoever they complained to will get pissed off
>> because 3 million people all complain about the same thing and then we
>> will get pissed off for having blown up innocent systems.
>>
>>> What I'm advocating is no more upgrades in next or next
>>> backports in 14.10 either.
>>
>> Less work is always fine with me ;)
>>
>> [1] https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/ubuntu/next
>
> Perhaps we need to start spreading the word in various places. Any
> suggestions about what to say, and where, and how often?

What I think is that the upgrader probably should go "can't upgrade,
your setup is not supported" and then either point to a webpage that
explains how to best go about solving this without a reinstall, or
perhaps better yet have the installer ppa-purge next and
next-backports and then upgrade.