Leaving Edubuntu

[David Van Assche]

Redirecting back to list, for the sake of transparency. I will not respond
to direct attacks and accusations. So I'll terminate my part in this thread
here.

kind regards,
David Van Assche
www.nubae.com

On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:40 PM, R. Scott Belford <scott at hosef.org> wrote:

> I'm sorry, David, but you are now moving into the area of flaming,
> inciting, and trolling.  Unless I missed something, it was made quite
> clear by Scott Balneaves about a month ago that Edubuntu was tracking
> debian-edu.  Edubuntu has everything to with Debian Edu in that
> *ubuntu is but an off-shoot of Debian.  Perhaps I am mistaken, but I
> am most familiar with Vagrant from his work as Debian's LTSP
> maintainer.  LTSP is pretty critical to debian-edu, and that work is
> pretty complementary to Edubuntu.  At least I always thought so.
>
> I'm totally okay if you want to attack me, troll me, discredit me, or
> question me.  Perhaps it can go off list, though, unless there is a
> way for it to be less taunting.  I have not included the list on this
> reply.  If this is your last word on these subjects, you are welcome
> to stand on your words.
>
> Aloha
>
> --scott
>
> On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 8:30 AM, David Van Assche <dvanassche at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Its clear you don't really know what you are talking about. Debian-edu
> has
> > nothing to do with Edubuntu, and Vagrant C is involved with upstream
> LTSP,
> > he has nothing to do with Edubuntu or Debian Edu for that matter. As far
> as
> > Debian goes, Vagrant C has done some great stuff with simple-cdd (a cd
> based
> > installer) and LTSP[1]
> >
> > I'm curious though, what specifically has he done that makes you his #1
> > fan....? I'm sure he's curious too :-)
> >
> > The people you should be mentioning are Jordan Mantha who has pretty much
> > single handedly done most Edubuntu packaging, triaging, and development.
> > Jonathan Carter Scott Balneaves, Alkis  Georgopoulos and Stephane Graber
> > have also helped out a great deal, though I couldn't get into specifics.
> > I've probably forgotten others, but the point is these people don't
> expect
> > to be put under the stage lights, they just quietly do stuff, amongst the
> > bickering and complaining which drowns out anything constructive.
> >
> > "The story" has been mentioned on this list and others countless times,
> > though I'm not going to start pulling out references. I just know I've
> heard
> > it more times than I care to think about...
> >
> > Please stick to what you know, and stop confusing people who are
> genuinely
> > here to help... If you really want to help out, the list I mentioned a
> > couple of emails back would be a great starting point...
> >
> > kind regards,
> > David Van Assche
> > www.nubae.com
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 2:53 PM, R. Scott Belford <scott at hosef.org>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> David, I could not care less about being "appreciated."  The problem
> >> with Edubuntu has been the void the community was left with following
> >> some strategic Canonical decisions.  I was in contact with the
> >> Canonical guys, they dropped the ball, and actually, we don't "all
> >> know the story."  I don't see what is any more important to the
> >> community right now.  The code base is now debian-edu, and I am
> >> Vagrant Cascadian's #1 fan.  Edubuntu seems to be branding only, and
> >> we need to be clear about it.  Are we submitting bugs to debian-edu,
> >> or are we repeating their efforts, re-tracking bugs at Launchpad, and
> >> calling it Edubuntu?
> >>
> >> --scott
> >>
> >> On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 2:44 AM, David Van Assche <dvanassche at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > I was actually looking for real items you are tackling within our
> >> > community
> >> > (Edubuntu) right now! Outside that, yes your list of good deeds is
> >> > impressive and wonderful (Most of the so called leadership can
> probably
> >> > write a good couple pages on their good deeds too...) We all know the
> >> > story
> >> > of how you couldn't get in contact with the Canonical guys, and how
> this
> >> > has
> >> > made you feel unappreciated.  But I think there's been enough
> repetition
> >> > of
> >> > that story for now, surely we can find more interesting things to talk
> >> > about
> >> > than the failure of communication during a meeting at one of the
> >> > UDSes...
> >> > (spilled milk comes to mind...)
> >> >
> >> > Anyway, this doesnt' really have much to do with giving perspective...
> >> > it
> >> > has to do with getting things done... all the perspective in the world
> >> > is
> >> > not gonna make any difference if it isnt followed by coding,
> >> > documentation,
> >> > bug squashing or the hundreds of other tasks open to volunteers...
> >> >
> >> > kind regards,
> >> > David Van Assche
> >> > www.nubae.com
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 2:08 PM, R. Scott Belford <scott at hosef.org>
> >> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> On Sun, Oct 4, 2009 at 8:56 PM, David Van Assche <
> dvanassche at gmail.com>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Anyway, people like Scott (-not- sbalneaves) would do well to
> involve
> >> >> > themselves in 'fixing' the problem, rather than spewing destructive
> >> >> > criticism at every possible turn of events. All I've ever seen from
> >> >> > your
> >> >> > emails is reasons as to why the people who really are working on
> >> >> > things
> >> >> > (the
> >> >> > leadership you call them, though non would consider themselves
> that)
> >> >> > are
> >> >> > doing it wrong. If that's the case, why don't YOU show us how its
> >> >> > done?
> >> >>
> >> >> With the greatest of respect, please allow me to clarify why I feel
> >> >> that I have invested enough by now to have a valid, experienced, and
> >> >> urgent perspective.  I am an advocate for users.  I am one who sews
> >> >> seeds in my community in hopes of inspiring tomorrow's engineers and
> >> >> software developers.  I am not a software developer, but I am a
> >> >> community developer.  I am the one, and HOSEF is the charity, that
> has
> >> >> sent pre-installed Edubuntu computers to Western Samoa, American
> >> >> Samoa, San Manuel, Manila, and Isabela in the Philippines, orphans
> and
> >> >> women rescued from the sex trade in Cambodia, and given thousands of
> >> >> gnu/linux computers to individuals and schools here in Hawaii.
> >> >>
> >> >> When you are a foster child in Hawaii, or you have aged out of the
> >> >> system, you have possibly come across me indirectly when seeking a
> >> >> computer or a laptop.  You got one that was tested and pre-installed
> >> >> with Debian Sarge, then it was Mandrake, then it became Edubuntu.  If
> >> >> you have been lucky enough to go through my Computer Guts class, then
> >> >> you are likely a foster child who learned how to build your own
> >> >> computer, install software, and type a one page essay, 12-point font,
> >> >> no skipping lines, on what you learned.  Chances are you were a 10-12
> >> >> year old girl, and you are now only a few years away from having
> these
> >> >> gifts blossom for you.  For about 5 years, twice a week, if you
> wanted
> >> >> hands-on help with open source software, you wanted to donate a
> >> >> computer, or you wanted to see what this 'linux thing' was all about,
> >> >> you found me waiting on you at a local school or business.
> >> >>
> >> >> If you are transitionally homeless, then you possibly got exposed to
> >> >> the K12LTSP at the Next Step homeless shelter.  If you are homeless
> >> >> and on our beaches, as many are, then perhaps you have access to the
> >> >> Edubuntu (now Debian) computers, with a printer and scanner and
> >> >> covered by a free but filtered wifi cloud, that I manage in 4 City
> and
> >> >> County Park recreation centers.  If you owe the State community
> >> >> service time, then you can serve our 501(c)(3) mission to promote and
> >> >> sustain FOSS by helping to set up our Free, donated, Gnu Linux
> >> >> Edutainment Learning centers.  You can help to pick up or to deliver
> >> >> donations.  Along the way you learn how kind and sharing those of us
> >> >> who care of FOSS can be.
> >> >>
> >> >> If you are one of our 300 schools in Hawaii without enough
> >> >> computers,or without enough knowledge, to bring the enterprise down
> to
> >> >> your size, for free, then you have been helped by me and the HOSEF
> >> >> volunteers.  The school project that gave birth to Fedora, now
> >> >> K12Linux, is maintained to this day by me for the sole reason of
> >> >> perpetuating the shining legacy that it should be.   In 2005 Hawaii
> >> >> became the first K12 school system in the US to offer Linux+
> >> >> certification to its students, and if you were in school then, you
> had
> >> >> access to manuals and training due to the relationships I forged with
> >> >> Novell and our DOE.  Lately, if you were Microsoft and you thought
> you
> >> >> were going to get America's only centralized DOE to use MS Office
> >> >> Live, then you were blindsided by how well-briefed and connected the
> >> >> Google Apps Education Team was when they swept in out of nowhere with
> >> >> a timely proposal.  You see, I am the 'linux guy' or 'that open
> source
> >> >> guy' that all of these people turn to for help, for answers, for
> >> >> support, and more, for free.
> >> >>
> >> >> If you are Richard Stallman, John Terpstra, Bruce Perens, Jon
> "maddog"
> >> >> Hall, Larry Rosen, Allen Gunn, or Aaron Seigo, among others, then I
> or
> >> >> someone kind to HOSEF has paid for you to come to Hawaii and join
> >> >> guests like Andre Hill, CJ Coppersmith, Dave Pickens, Barton George,
> >> >> Horst Herb, Jim Thompson, our City CIO, Hawaii Legislators, and
> >> >> others, for our annual conference.  While here you might have joined
> >> >> me at the Hilton Hawaiian Village where the world's A-List of Telecom
> >> >> Executives - Boeing, France Telecom, ATT, Verizon, Rogers, China
> >> >> Telcom, Korean Telcom, Orange, etc., etc., checked email and did
> their
> >> >> conference web-browsing on an "e-waste" 30-station thin-client email
> >> >> garden that I set up and supported for three years as a ubiquity
> test.
> >> >>  FOSS passed in flying colors.  I did, and do, all this as a
> volunteer
> >> >> service in reciprocity for the great software you help me use for
> >> >> free.  I am hoping to inspire more creators with, and less users of,
> >> >> Free and Open Source Software.  If I cannot pick up the developers
> >> >> torch, then maybe they can.
> >> >>
> >> >> The projects I am working on now are bigger than any of this other
> >> >> stuff.  I am disappointed, David, that you would personally pile on
> >> >> like this without any awareness of or respect for the greater good
> >> >> that I am working for.  I have admired your work using Opensuse and,
> >> >> in particular, your indexing and compiling efforts of late.  I am
> >> >> friend to all, and I am a defender of the newcomer, the newbie, the
> >> >> person who wants to feel the vibe of Egoboo, and those who wish
> >> >> someone was here to help.  Oh, and if you look at our website to find
> >> >> most of this, you won't find it because I hate, no, I HATE, no,
> >> >> actually, I kind of *HATE* the tedium of doing that kind of stuff and
> >> >> have long wished for a Bard and a Scribe.
> >> >>
> >> >> I am not sure if this is "how its done", but it's what I do.  Last
> >> >> year, in August, during Linuxworld 2008, I addressed my Edubuntu
> >> >> issues with the most senior Canonical employees available at IBM's
> >> >> reception at The W.  I set up meetings for Canonical/Ubuntu with the
> >> >> University of Hawaii's CIO and the City and County of Honolulu's CIO
> >> >> to catalyze a support-oriented relationship.  Canonical failed to
> >> >> follow through.  Wherever you are, seriously, go get the CIO of your
> >> >> State or your Country's leading University, and the CIO of America's
> >> >> 11th largest City, to agree to meet with people from Canonical about
> >> >> supporting a Desktop rollout only to get blown off.  Do this while
> >> >> being the volunteer marketing and support department for Edubuntu and
> >> >> FOSS in general, and do it for about 8 years straight, and you'll
> >> >> appreciate why I find great offense that a volunteer in Ace came and
> >> >> left and all I see, again, is the circling of the developer clique.
> >> >>
> >> >> With Aloha
> >> >>
> >> >> --scott
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> >
> >> > Stephen Leacock  - "I detest life-insurance agents: they always argue
> >> > that I
> >> > shall some day die, which is not so."
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Joan Crawford  - "I, Joan Crawford, I believe in the dollar. Everything I
> > earn, I spend."
>



-- 

Ted Turner <http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/t/ted_turner.html>  -
"Sports is like a war without the killing."
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