[UbuntuWomen] Ubuntu-women IRC channel discussion

Amber Graner akgraner at gmail.com
Thu Jan 7 19:39:51 GMT 2010

On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 11:15 AM, Elizabeth Krumbach <lyz at ubuntu.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 8:33 AM, Melissa Draper <melissa at meldraweb.com> wrote:
>> counsel/mentoring out in the cold, there will probably still be a
>> contingent who continue to believe we're an clique of chauvinist
>> Amazonian fem-bots intent on taking over the world.
> I understand that it is an exaggeration, but I am very uncomfortable
> with this wording and feel shines a bad light on folks who have
> approached us with legitimate concerns over the state of the channel.
> Please let's try to keep this discussion in real terms and encourage
> opposing viewpoints on this subject :)
> That said what DO we think about incident reporting in the channel as
> part of the channel purpose?

Aside from logging which seems to be a non- issue until we decided
what the channel(s) are supposed to be for -

So do we want the channel to be a combination of:

Option 1 - social, technical, Ubuntu Women Project Goals and place
were women can come for advice about any issue  to include but not
limited to the Ubuntu Community (ie incident reporting) logged


Option 2 -  social, technical, Ubuntu Women Project Goals and where
women can come to about advice on anything they regard as an issue
within the Ubuntu Community and the Ubuntu Project. (ie incident
reporting) logged


Option 3 - social, technical, Ubuntu Women Project Goals place were
women can come for advice about any issue with regards to include but
not limited to the Ubuntu Community (ie incident reporting)- not


Option 4 - social, technical, Ubuntu Women Project Goals and where
women can come to about advice on anything they regard as an issue
within the Ubuntu Community and the Ubuntu Project.(ie incident
reporting)  not logged


Option 5 - social, and where women can get advice on anything they
regard as an issue as a (ie incident reporting) - not logged


Option 6 - social, Ubuntu Women Project Goals, and technical and
issues as it relates to UW within the Ubuntu Community (ie incident
reporting) logged

(Option 5 and 6 mean creating 2 channels for the group)

Ok so realistically since there is a social aspect to every team
(saying good morning, asking how someone is, how's the latests thing
they are working on, anyone every have this happen, what do you think
about that), the way I see it social is the thing that stays constant.

Ubuntu Women Project Goals - should happen naturally as people
belonging to the team would like to help meet those goals in some form
or fashion.

Technical - I see this as either giving support in the channel if
someone can help directly with a technical question and/or encouraging
folks who may not know about  channels such as -devel, and other
ubuntu-whatever channel, to encourage them to use those channels to
ask questions in them as there may be other people who have the same

Issues - being able to talk about or report issues within the Ubuntu
Community or sometimes maybe as simple as has anyone ever had this
happen what do you think I should do?

Personally, I like Option 2 . I don't think we need to micro-define
every purpose.  I wish there was not a need for a women's Project, but
there is.  The IRC channel is only one point to the bigger picture.
Many of us do things in the greater open source community so we share
those ideas with each other.  We are all at varying skill levels and
interests. There are as many levels of opinions on what is or is not
offensive as there are what is or isn't feminism.

Though feminism is discussed, the project is nether feminist nor
anti-feminist as the project it should allow each person the freedom
to decide for themselves whether a person is or isn't.  The project is
called "Ubuntu" Women - thus the main concentration should be on
Ubuntu. The channel (s) is only one aspect of the team.  Yet it seems
to be the most highly visible viewpoint of the overall team to people
within and outside the community. Should our goals as a team not be
reflected within the channel as well?  If there is an issue with the
Ubuntu Community as it regards to women - then we can address those
things as it happens, or encourage and give advice on how they could
handle it.   I like the coffee shop feel to it and would hate to lose

Let's look at the channel purpose define it - then after we define it
let's see if there is a need for two channels or just one channel
based on the criteria.  Then we can better determine whether logging
fits with the purpose of the channel.


> As I see it:
> Pros:
>  * Lowers barrier to incident reporting so it's less likely a woman
> will be scared off by a "process" and can report things easily
>  * Provides a space where sensitive topics to be discussed, which are
> important for the goals of the project
>  * If specific names, places etc details are not included in reporting
> the incident, it can be a healthy place to discuss challenges we all
> may have faced and give feedback on current situations we're dealing
> with. The channel has served this purpose well in the past few years.
> Cons:
>  * We may be encouraging folks to report incidents in a space that
> they assume is safe and secure when it may not be[0]
>  * If details are included in the report I believe we will have
> problems, logging or not - if it's logged all incidents reported are
> viewable by the world, if it's not logged we continue to have to fight
> the stigma within the community that we're a secretive project
> Either way, I think there should always be a way to report incidents,
> with details, to leader(s) of the project directly without fear - just
> like the Community Council provides for the rest of the Ubuntu
> community.
> [0] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-women/2010-January/002366.html
> --
> Elizabeth Krumbach // Lyz // pleia2
> http://www.princessleia.com
> --
> Ubuntu-Women mailing list
> Ubuntu-Women at lists.ubuntu.com
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-women

Amber Graner//akgraner//

Just me Amber.

There are lots of Linux users who don't care how the kernel works, but
only want to use it. That is a tribute to how good Linux is.
Linus Torvalds

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