INPROCESS Re: root password...[ubuntu 5.10 installation issues]

Thu Dec 15 03:39:27 UTC 2005

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It would appear that on Dec 14, David Hart did say:

> > On Mon, Dec 12, 2005 at 10:01:37PM -0500, Joe(theWordy)Philbrook wrote:

> > > Third: all distros tend to have strengths and weaknesses. Ubuntu has less 
> > > weaknesses than most, so I use it. sudo/root is just a peculiarity that is 
> > > pretty easy to live with, and easy to bypass if you feel strongly about 
> > > it. Simply do <sudo passwd root> and off you go. What's the problem?

 - - - - - - - - -< s n i p >- - - - - - - - - -

 in reply to the above text where a different "david" expressed what
 sounded like a concerned question. "What's the problem?" Some where in
 the middle of a long multi-point message, that while informative sounded
 somewhat humorous to me... did cause me to make the mistake of
 explaining away the idea that that was a problem by saying that the
 biggest problem was something as trivial as other peoples preferences.
 and that "I felt like" I was starting to bug them. Of course it would
 turn out that most of the advice to give sudo a chance came mostly from
 one person. Who apparently wasn't offended before I just stuck my foot in
 my mouth by jokingly alluding to it as a big problem...

 - - - - - - - - -< s n i p >- - - - - - - - - -

> > Actually it didn't take that long to find out from this thread that since
> > I DO, as you say, "feel strongly about it" I could fix it.

And yup, you David was definitely one of the first to include a way of
re-enabling root...  Thank You!

> > The biggest
> > problem was that it felt like those who feel just as strongly the other
> > way were getting offended because I knew I didn't want to use sudo
> > before I read all the arguments for it. ( I never said I wouldn't read
> > the arguments. It's just that at least for now, I wasn't taking my closed
> > system there.)
> 
> Seeing as you've seen fit to comment on others above who caused you a
> 'problem', I think I'll add a comment or two of my own.

Yeah go ahead. I probably deserve it. Though I really wasn't trying to
imply that you (or anybody else in ubuntu) was CAUSING me a problem.
But I can see that I chose my words poorly. 

> The only person I've seen express strong views on sudo/root is
> yourself.

It is true that I'm the only one in this thread who expressed strongly
his view on using sudo instead of a root account. Course I only feel
strongly about it as it applies to MY pc. That others might use it in
preference to risk having a root account on their box is fine with me.

> I was one of the first to reply to your request for help with the
> 'root problem' and the first to clearly show you to do 'sudo passwd
> root' to fix that.

Yup, as noted above, Thanks again.

> I haven't got strong views (and certainly not feelings) on sudo/root
> either way and I'll let you into a little 'secret'.  I have root
> enabled on _all_ my boxen (for reasons that I won't go into here).

Don't need to go into them. They are your reasons for a choice you made
on your own for your own stuff. 

> I am certainly not offended if you choose to enable root, just puzzled
> that someone would choose to install a new distro when time is so
> short that they wouldn't have the opportunity to get the feel for it.

Well I'm glad your not actually offended. Though I do apologize for my
choice of words. 

Now about what you say "puzzled" you:

There are some things that take time to get a feel for. And some things
that depend on other things getting done first. Once I've got my box
configured well enough to actually stay put instead of having to boot one
of my other linux every time I'm checking my mail etc. Then I'll find
time to get comfortable with it, even if by then, it's usually no more
than a half hour at a time.

I chose to add ubuntu because of what I'd heard about it. I was looking
for something that wasn't hard to install (like debian sounded to me
when I considered it a while ago) But I needed something that was
dependable and easy to add/remove packages to/from. I had been having
problems with the installers for the other *two main distros I'd been
trying to keep reasonably up to date. (till the last time I ran out of
time...)

*One only worked in it's more informative gui mode if I didn't need to
tell it anything about /dev/hdc (my 2nd hard drive) Otherwise as soon as
I "clicked" on that side of the partitioner display the installer seized
up... Though it still installed reliably in text mode.

*The other was very picky about what partitions it would install on.
 And two out of three install versions failed after installing far enough
 to let me play with the new user account if I wanted would on all
 successive boot attempt appear to boot normally until the root partition
 was remounted in rw mode whereupon everything that it tried to do got
 "permission denied" and it could not even shutdown... 

Thus I was seeking a distro with an installer that didn't make me
nervous.

Then came the idea that ubuntu was easy to install. And allowed less than
expert users who did at least have a clue use a powerful update manager
that pretty much worked out of the box...
Then while I was browsing some of "ubuntulinux.org" I realized I had a
good week to install it in. So ubuntu sounded to good to pass up. 
Though knowing my thick-headedness I figured I'd need the whole week.

For what it's worth, I've already gotten quite comfortable with parts of
ubuntu. I've only played with it's installer three times, (all three were
with 5.10) But it seams to be consistent enough for me to like. What I've
seen of the supported software makes me think the guy who told me about
ubuntu was right that it's been getting more 'love' than certain other
distros have lately... 

> And, despite what you say above, you made it quite clear in a 100
> line self described 'rant' relpy to one of my posts that you have no
> intention of using sudo whatever the reasons.

I did say that was a rant...    What I have no intention of doing is
using sudo to configure my box. After I get it configured my way, I'd
consider any reasons to try it that I hadn't already. But I sure wasn't
using sudo from a dummy user account that knowing I wasn't keeping it
long, I had given a trivial password, to do all my root stuff with...
OK so I could have changed the password. I never said I wasn't stubborn.

I don't create my user accounts till I get my preferred default software
installed and (configured in /etc/skel)

> What I do find slightly offensive, however, is that someone who clearly
> has both the technical capability and the time (as amply demonstrated
> by yourself over the last three days) chooses to use other people to
> do the 'leg work' rather than doing a little research themselves.

Actually I did some looking around on the web myself. And yes, I have
some technical ability. Though there are some holes in my knowledge. And
I do have some difficulty with remembering things I don't do the same
way a lot. I'm sorry if I've apparently been letting others do to
much of my legwork. But about having the time, the last three days are
NOT typical of the usual amount of time I'll have to spend on it.

As I explained in that same rant you mention above...:

=> I'm currently working a third shift job that combined with my lady's
=> demands on my usable "conscious" time leaves precious little for my
=> hobby. So little in fact that if I didn't have an knee injury putting me
=> out of work for about a week I wouldn't have dared to even consider
=> installing an unfamiliar linux distro to my multi-boot PC.

Once this week is over I'll not have nearly so much time to spend on it.

> If it really bothered me (it doesn't), I know perfectly well how to
> redirect your mails to /dev/null.

I'm glad it didn't really bother you. I'm hoping that over time I might
be able to contribute something useful now and again.  If I made it
to your killfile I'd miss any chance of your finding out that I'm not
just a leach. And that would be sad.

In any case do have a nice day. 

Joe

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