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[Brett Kirksey]

On Sunday 03 October 2004 at 18:25+0200, Oliver Grawert wrote:

>  Am Sonntag, den 03.10.2004, 11:12 -0400 schrieb GR Gaudreau:

> > . . . but if you wish to learn the command line and its
> > powers -- and it's powerful! -- then you have to go to "the
> > dark place" and practice, and you won't do that if you
> > aren't challenged to learn; and techie talk is, to me, a
> > challenge to learn.

> assuming that the average user wants this, but i think the
> average user will just want to use her desktop and the
> applications....

Yes, yes, yes! This is what I've been saying over and over again
in several posts. Traditionally, the average Linux attitude is,
"Look at all this power and complexity. You too can learn it
young Jedi, I will teach you. But only after I guide you through
the initiation of 'The Install' will you get to wield the
'Command Line' saber." The problem is the average user doesn't
_want_ the power or complexity or command line. They just
want a stable operating system that's easy to work with.

> > Linux is about power, stability, power, usefulness,
> > security, power -- did I mention power? :-) -- well you get
> > the picture. The command line is one of the most, if not
> > THE most powerful tools in Linux. . .

> getting back to my above statement, how many win users do you
> know that are able to tweak their registry? if ubuntu wants
> to cope with the huge userbase out there, ther is a _must_ to
> make the distribution accessible for the non techie (the
> "just works approach"). 

Whatever happened to "Linux is about ease of use." Like it or
not Mac OS X has a unix core and a command line. Ninety-five
percent of the Mac users have no knowledge or desire to use it.
They have a sleek, powerful, stable, and user friendly operating
system that just works. And they have "power" if they wish to
seek it. But they don't have to become a "techie" just to get
their OS installed, listen to some music, browse the Web, and
send an e-mail. Linux can be like this and Ubuntu could be the
first--if the traditional Linux user will let it.

> it's nice that you aim to learn more about "this stuff under
> the hood" and you're very welcome to aks every question i can
> answer, but the masses (my parents, the average surfer guy,
> your grandma, whoever) should not need to become a mechanic
> to drive their cars ;-)

I could not say it any better!

If Ubuntu is going to make the impact it has the potential for,
the traditional Linux user running should probably be prepared
to welcome users who aren't like them (i.e. they don't work on
their computers for fun--they want their computers to "just
work.") There are some great people on this list and many that
are eager to make Linux as easy as possible. But I think there
are still a few who have their egos tied to their tech
knowledge, and it would be an insult to have a "newbie" able to
get a system running without any special knowledge.

Brett