Has somebody a stable Ubuntu Studio NATTY 64-bit?
Ralf Mardorf
ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net
Mon May 30 22:45:14 UTC 2011
On Mon, 2011-05-30 at 18:05 -0400, Mike Holstein wrote:
> ralph
>
>
> ardour not only works fine for me for professional use, but as i said,
> i actually do prefer it. protools is arguably the industry standard in
> digital audio recording, and i have seen it, and ardour both crash.
> both ardour and protools (as well as other DAW's) seem to do a good
> job of keeping the files as they record. *one time ardour crashed
> while i was recording, and again, as i said before, it was an issue
> with something i was trying in JACK that caused the crash. however,
> the file i recorded was still there, so, i didnt, and still haven't
> actually lost any data using ardour.
I never lost any recording when Ardour crashed. And even if I would have
lost data, even if I would pay another musician, there's a difference
between paying a studio musician for additional 30 Minutes and paying
for an Orchestra, the room etc.. It's also not the point if any
proprietary software is better or not. It's just that always something
happens that makes a recording more expensive than it was planed, a
crashing software can't be used. And an audio engineer does cost money
too. You and I might cost 100,- EUR/hour, but nearly nobody knows you or
me. Somebody like Al Schmitt perhaps does cost a little bit more than
100,- EUR/hour ;), but I dunno, just a guess.
>
>
> i believe our argument is originating from a general misunderstanding.
> i believe you are saying ardour, as well as any computer based
> recording system is not appropriate for professional audio? this
> opinion is arguable, however, what is not arguable is the main reason
> why professional and home studios use computers for recording in the
> first place... cost. purchasing analog tape, and maintaining analog
> equipment is quite expensive. digital recording has allowed home
> studios to get nice professional quality results, as well as allow
> professional studios to pass the savings of digital media use on to
> the client.
Full ACK, maintaining analog equipment is expensive, that's why I lost
my equipment. I never get any payable digital equipment that even is
able to reach the quality of my good maintained analog 4 track cassette
recorder. I should mount the RME card now, but I'm sure this card won't
reach the quality too ... I'll know more in some days ;).
The problem for analog devices is, that after a while there's nothing to
recalibrate, things needs to be replaced, for doing this you not only
need a service manual, you also need e.g. for a cassette recorder
special tapes etc., in other words, you need expensive tools. And please
don't confuse a maintained cassette recorder, with a common cassette
recorder.
The digital home recording devices I heard, that had a good audio
quality were firewire devices for the Mac. I only remember the name
Motu, but there were others too.
I never heard a M-Audio myself, but I trust Thomas. I never heard a RME
card.
I heard a lot of Linux recordings I like, but never one that regarding
to the sound quality was comparable to any professional studio recording
or any analog home recoding. Btw. the sound quality isn't the most
important thing for a recording, much more important is the music.
But reliability and quality are important for professional productions,
even for LadyGaga and Co., behind the loudness trash there still is
sound that can't be produced with less expensive equipment.
>
>
> again, if you find a specific issue with ardour that is not working
> properly, or meeting your needs, PLEASE get involved in resolving the
> issue. if you dont like digital recording or ardour, then you dont
> need to use it. and again, PLEASE do not spread things such as..
>
>
> "Thats not true! I like Ardour2. It's very, very good, but you can't
> do
> professional work with it."
>
> ...since many of us actually do use if for professional work quite
> regularly.
You are ignorant! You seem to believe your own words.
Just because Ardour and other computer stuff isn't the best, it's not
bad at all. But claiming something has capabilities that it doesn't have
is nonsense. Why? Is there any reason that Ardour has to be
professional? Is there something bad with not being professional?
I've got friends who do very interesting work and I've got friends who
do very boring work, but they are all friends.
And it's much less important for things like Ardour. Ardour is not
professional and other audio things are professional, that's a fact, but
doesn't mean that Ardour is bad.
Linux audio for me isn't a golden calf! I'm using Linux only for private
audio work. From time to time, very seldom, I still do audio jobs and
pardon, there is a substantial difference.
But we are wasting our time with this discussion ;).
Cheers!
Ralf
>
>
> thanks for your understanding
>
>
>
> On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Ralf Mardorf
> <ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net> wrote:
>
> On Mon, 2011-05-30 at 16:35 -0400, Mike Holstein wrote:
> > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Ralf Mardorf
> > <ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, 2011-05-30 at 14:15 -0400, Mike Holstein
> wrote:
> > > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 1:44 PM, Ralf Mardorf
> > > <ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> > > Hi Karl :)
> > >
> > > today I got a RME card, very, very
> expensive. I'm
> > curious
> > > about it. I
> > > wonder if it will sound better than all
> the other
> > cards I
> > > know, or if I
> > > just spend money for nothing. I bought a
> B-stock
> > (customer
> > > return), so
> > > somebody perhaps wasn't satisfied by this
> card ;).
> > >
> > > ACK, but no full ACK regarding to "Linux
> audio isn't
> > that
> > > good, as
> > > proprietary audio is". MIDI jitter for hw
> MIDI is an
> > issue on
> > > all OS,
> > > AFAIK only Nuendo should be good and still
> with
> > limitations.
> > > There
> > > should be no App for Apple or Microsoft
> systems,
> > excepted of
> > > Nuendo.
> > > Using Jack2 from svn + a2jmidi_bridge on
> my Maverick
> > install
> > > had at
> > > least for one song, completely no
> limitation. It was
> > hard
> > > real-time as
> > > good as C64, Atari ST and 80's stand alone
> > sequencers, there
> > > was no
> > > jitter.
> > > Regarding to audio it depends to the
> needs. If I
> > should get
> > > rid of audio
> > > loss, I'm satisfied for home recording.
> Just for
> > professional
> > > work
> > > Ardour2 IMO isn't stable enough. Sometimes
> it crash
> > and
> > > sometimes still
> > > is to often, regarding to contract
> penalty.
> > >
> > > Best,
> > >
> > > Ralf
> > >
> > >
> > > for me, ardour is quite a bit more stable than
> cubase was
> > for me in
> > > XP, as well as more capable. i usually find when
> ardour is
> > crashy, its
> > > something im doing which is causing the
> instability. i was
> > trying the
> > > new irlv2 plugin, and that seemed to cause
> instability. i
> > tried using
> > > another packaged version of the irlv2 plug from
> falktx's
> > KXstudio ppa,
> > > and ardour (so far) has been stable again. i
> personally
> > enjoy the way
> > > JACK lets me push my system, and find the
> limitations of my
> > hardware.
> > > i remember doing something similar in cubase where
> i would
> > push the
> > > limits of latency and get a less stable system,
> making
> > cubase less
> > > stable. i have been in studios where most of the
> big name
> > current
> > > popular DAW's have crashed. when you push any
> system to its
> > limits,
> > > you can get instability. i find Paul Davis and the
> ardour
> > team to be
> > > quite responsive to comments and bug reports. if
> you are
> > experiencing
> > > ardour instability not relating to personal
> configuration
> > errors, i
> > > urge you to get involved, and report your
> findings.
> > personally, i find
> > > if i relax my JACK settings a bit, the system
> becomes stable
> > again.
> >
> >
> > I'm not abreast of the times regarding to the
> professional
> > audio work
> > that costs much money. Some years ago computers were
> only used
> > in the
> > studio, for live recordings or orchestra sessions
> stand-alone
> > devices
> > analog and/or digital were used. I remember one
> session at the
> > Sender
> > Berlin, Al Schmitt came from the USA and the
> equipment was a
> > bus from
> > France, the only computer was for the Neve's Flying
> Faders
> > (fader
> > automation ;) and this computer was invisible ;).
> The recorder
> > was a
> > digital Sony tape recorder. I wonder if somebody
> like Al
> > Schmitt would
> > use any computer today, so I did a google pic
> search ...
> > there's
> > something in the background :D ...
> >
> http://www.grammy.com/files/imagecache/photo_gallery_full_size_image/news/producera_maury_60232914_max.jpg?1296662944
> >
> > Btw. he's one of the few very likeable professional
> engineers
> > I met,
> > most of those VIP engineers are complete assholes.
> > I should have thought he won't use a computer, but I
> guess I
> > was
> > mistaken.
> >
> > OTOH, if you take a look at this kind of studios,
> e.g.
> >
> http://www.chicksingernight.com/contest/Recording-TheVillage.jpg it
> > might be that those computers are quasi
> stand-alone-devices,
> > customized
> > to the whole equipment.
> >
> > I very often asked the community to give me the name
> of at
> > least one big
> > audio studio using Linux and I always noticed that
> they not
> > really know
> > what a professional studio is.
> >
> > What ever those guys are using, it's not Ardour2 ;).
> >
> > http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=al+schmitt+audio
> >
> +engineer&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&biw=1024&bih=599&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi
> >
> > Hm? Bruce Sweeden? A bossom friend of Dirk
> Brauner ... Oops
> > this is the
> > correct writing "Bruce Swedien"
> >
> > There are monitors in the background, unfortunately
> tze pics
> > are just
> > thumbnails.
> http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=Bruce+Swedien
> > +audio
> >
> +engineer&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&biw=1024&bih=599&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi
> >
> > are you saying professional studios dont run ardour?.. to be
> clear, i
> > was pointing out that ANY DAW, on any OS can become
> unstable, and i
> > was also pointing out that if you are experiencing
> instability with
> > ardour, feel free to properly report the issue so all of us
> can take
> > advantage of the bug reporting and fixing.
> >
> >
> > as far as pro studios running ardour, my studio runs ardour.
> so does
> > this one http://www.sonicstudio.it/
>
>
> This studio might be a good studio, don't get me wrong, but it
> has
> nothing in common with the real big studios. I guess the
> difference is
> visible ;). Anyway, the productions from this studio could be
> very good,
> I don't know it, but it's a small studio. I call this a home
> recording
> studio.
>
> > , and of course there is/was the
> > http://www.sae.edu/en-gb/content/80/Ardour_-_SAE_Edition .
>
>
> Haha SAE, in Germany they are an absolute joke, never met a
> good
> engineer from SAE, of cause they are important customers, even
> for
> professional companies that sell equipment. But forget SAE,
> it's
> completely non-serious. SAE are crooks in Germany! They aren't
> professional, Brauner sold stuff to them, we know SAE. It's an
> non-serious school.
>
> > there are plenty others if you want to google around and
> look them up.
> > i dont feel i need to defend ardour to anyone. if it works
> for you,
> > use it, and if it doesnt, then use what works for you.
> theres no
> > shortage of DAW's, even in linux (such as
> http://www.renoise.com/).
> > HOWEVER, do not help spread a false idea that linux and/or
> ardour is
> > not up to the task. are there limitations? of course. i
> think all
> > DAW's/OS's are going to have limitations. AFAIK, we dont
> really have a
> > good easy way to do 5.1 mixing in linux. video production
> software is
> > what it is. ardour2 doesnt have MIDI support, but version 3
> will/does.
> > for me the combination of JACK + ubuntustudio with all the
> apps that
> > support JACK out of the box, and the interconnectivity that
> that gives
> > me is a win. if i did more MIDI sequencing, i might have a
> different
> > opinion, but i hope ardour3 is a good answer to that
> particular
> > workflow.
>
>
> How often did you record big orchestras in studio halls? I
> guess you and
> I we are talking about different things, when we are talking
> about
> professional audio engineering. I'm not talking about my home
> MIDI
> music, I'm talking about the jobs I did and about the jobs
> other people
> still do. If Ardour2 would crash you might need to repeat a 60
> minutes
> recording with 30 musicians and a large studio hall, a studio
> bus etc.,
> this is very much money.
> >
> >
> > PLEASE help us spread the work about how capable the
> software we have
> > is. if you prefer using protools or whatever, thats great,
> and i
> > personally welcome the constructive discussions of those
> differences,
> > and what is working well, and what is not, and why cubase or
> protools
> > (or whatever) is preferred. but please dont spread any
> misinformation
> > about how ardour is not capable.
>
>
> *chuckle* You spread misinformation. 1. I'm not pro
> protools!!! 2.
> Ardour2 can't be used. A crash could cost thousands of $.
>
> > a preference is a preference, but ardour is awesome, and
> utilized by
> > professionals all over the world.
>
>
> Thats not true! I like Ardour2. It's very, very good, but you
> can't do
> professional work with it.
> >
> >
> > i apologize if i misunderstood you, i can be defensive about
> the
> > software and community im passionate about.
>
>
> There's nothing bad with home recording. I'm poor and I like
> to get
> FLOSS home recording software. But audio engineering was my
> job.
>
> Best,
>
> Ralf
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Ubuntu-Studio-users mailing list
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > MH
> >
> > http://opensourcemusician.libsyn.com/
> > http://wnclug.ourproject.org/
> >
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>
> --
> MH
>
> http://opensourcemusician.libsyn.com/
> http://wnclug.ourproject.org/
>
>
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