UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager dwelling

Fri May 6 23:31:12 UTC 2011

Hi,
I have been using Ubuntu fulltime for years now, and have not gone back.
I also tried to take part in developing, but never really had time to
properly mature in that, so instead, I used to try and tweak lots of
programs on my system.
One of my trials was on a Tablet PC which I have been using for a while,
and I have not liked any of the on board keyboards available, except for
one:
http://florence.sourceforge.net/english.html
I have always wanted it to be included in Ubuntu, but it never came round
to that.
I have however had a good relationship with the developer, and he kept it
always up to date to work on Ubuntu, and I always tested it and gave him
back feedback, to which he promptly replied and updated the code.
I like the capability to make the keyboard as transparent as needed, and
the fact it comes up upon trying to type text, as well as some other very
nice features for a tablet.
I had only one problem with it, which was when Firefox would suggest links,
which would go over the keyboard, so I wold disable the firefox suggestion
feature.
I have used it for all my work on the Tablet, and set up onboard keyboard
for login in and to log in when the PC locked, but I'm sure with
integration, this could also replace onboard completely, but requires a bit
of help from the DEV team to the developer.
I upgraded to Natty recently, and I noticed that it was not easy to use
access the Florence keybaord anymore, due to the change done to the Task
bar at the top (although I could make the hover icon appear, but I
personally don't like it).
So I thought to myself that I can probably contact the developer again to
update for this change, but I got kind of shy :-)
Everytime he updates for the changes, but florence is still not in the repo
nor supported, and I promised him before that I will push this through, and
I did try, but it never happened.
So I thought to myself that maybe instead of of once again asking him to
update and make changes, if I could get anyone from the DEV group to try
the software out, and tell use what they think.
I honestly think it is the best out there so far, and many people who tried
my Tablet agree with this.
Onboard is just too incumbent and the transparency feature is not there,
and thus covers the screen all the time, and on Tablets, the screen space
is essential to be free.
Also, I noticed that the keyboard does not show up with pressing the top
left button to show quick program and search, etc.
I hope to hear what people think after they try it.
Regards,
Ramaddan
<ubuntu-devel-request at lists.ubuntu.com> wrote on 7 May 2011, 01:47 AM:
Subject: ubuntu-devel Digest, Vol 81, Issue 7
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>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager -
> dwelling (Alan Bell)
> 2. Re: UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager -
> dwelling (Francesco Fumanti)
> 3. systemd for 11.10 ? (Thomas Bechtold)
> 4. UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager - dwelling
> (Francesco Fumanti)
> 5. Ideas for the icon panel and menu behaviour (Shane.Nuessler)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Thu, 05 May 2011 21:05:55 +0100
>From: Alan Bell <alanbell at ubuntu.com>
>To: Francesco Fumanti <francesco.fumanti at gmx.net>
>Cc: Charlie Kravetz <cjk at teamcharliesangels.com>, Ubuntu Devel list
> <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>, Penelope Stowe <pstowe at gmail.com>,
> robert.ancell at ubuntu.com, marmuta <marmvta at googlemail.com>, Luke
> Yelavich <themuso at ubuntu.com>, Alan Bell <"alanbell"@ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Re: UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager -
> dwelling
>Message-ID: <4DC30323.9030805 at ubuntu.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
>Hi Francesco,
>
>thanks for the email, that was informative and timely.
>
>1)
>The discussions around different options came about because of a 
>suggestion from the upstream Gnome accessibility team that we should 
>consider using the 'official' gnome on-screen keyboard which is now 
>Caribou. So far I have been unable to install caribou and I am not sure 
>what it's good features are really. I think there should be one keyboard 
>that serves as an accessibility tool, is the keyboard for tablets and 
>touchscreens (including multitouch), looks good and can be used for 
>innovative layouts such as the steno chording layout. One current 
>challenge is getting the keyboard to type into the unity-3d interface 
>(works fine in unity-2d) and this is mostly a unity issue although I 
>wouldn't discount the possibility that some integration might need to 
>touch the keyboard (things like the keyboard not zooming in and out with 
>compiz zoom).
>
>2)
> > Does this mean that LightDM is going to replace GDM?
>no, it means the possibility is going to be discussed at UDS. A lot of 
>things get discussed and sometimes we decide not to do them - or maybe 
>decide to revisit the possibility some releases later.
>
>3)
>that is a good point and some interesting suggestions, we already know 
>it is too hard to start onboard without the use of a hard keyboard, it 
>would be ideal if dwelling could be turned on without clicking. (still 
>not quite as bad as asking people to press space when they see the icon 
>at the start of the installer to get to the screen reader install)
>
>Alan.
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 20:20:15 +0200
>From: Francesco Fumanti <francesco.fumanti at gmx.net>
>To: Robert Ancell <robert.ancell at canonical.com>
>Cc: Charlie Kravetz <cjk at teamcharliesangels.com>, Ubuntu Devel list
> <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>, Penelope Stowe <pstowe at gmail.com>,
> robert.ancell at ubuntu.com, marmuta <marmvta at googlemail.com>, Luke
> Yelavich <themuso at ubuntu.com>, Alan Bell <"alanbell"@ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Re: UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager -
> dwelling
>Message-ID: <4DC43BDF.10200 at gmx.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
>Hi Robert,
>
>Thanks for your reply.
>
>On 06.05.2011 07:52, Robert Ancell wrote:
>> On 05/05/2011 06:55 PM, Francesco Fumanti wrote:
>>> 2) Display manager
>>>
>>> I have come accross the following blueprint for oneiric:
>>> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-lightdm
>>>
>>> Does this mean that LightDM is going to replace GDM?
>> That is my proposal. The decision will be made at UDS, however at the
>> last UDS there seemed good support for it (I delayed the use due to
>> Unity last cycle) so I am hopeful that people will agree it is worth
>> changing to.
>
>So chances might be good for it to be adopted.
>
>>> I just ran a test session in natty where I replaced GDM with the
>>> LightDM display manager available in the repository, but I did not get
>>> beyond the login screen, because there was no explicit way to enable
>>> an onscreen keyboard...
>> Thanks for testing. a11y is a high priority requirement for LightDM and
>> I'm looking for requirements. If you're able to attend the UDS session
>> that would be awesome as I need experienced a11y people to give me a
>> list of requirements and good feedback.
>
>Sorry, I am not attending UDS.
>
>Concerning the implementation of the accessibility features, I suppose that
>the best will be to have contact with several people in order to cover the
>different kinds of accessibility needs. As a pointer only user, I can tell
>you how I imagine things for people that control the computer with only a
>mouse (with and without a hardware button to click).
>
>Unfortunately, I can't help you with the accessibility features needed by
>switch users, or visually, auditive or cognitive impaired users.
>
>Recently, I read the following on a gnome list: the other of that email (I
>do not know him) might be of some help concerning switch access.
>http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-accessibility-list/2011-May/msg00000.html
>
>
>And last, but not least:the Accessibility Team of Ubuntu...
>
>>> There is already a little menu to increase the font size and set a
>>> high contrast. Thus, I would like to ask whether this menu could not
>>> be enhanced with more accessibility features; maybe also turning it
>>> into a dialog. A starting point might be the accessibility features
>>> available in the GDM accessibility dialog.
>> Absolutely. The current implementation is very basic, and any new login
>> screen that would be released in Ubuntu will require a design and these
>> features implemented.
>
>Great,:-)
>
>Cheers,
>
>Francesco
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2011 18:24:58 +0200
>From: Thomas Bechtold <thomasbechtold at jpberlin.de>
>To: ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: systemd for 11.10 ?
>Message-ID: <1304180698.2689.1.camel at salbei>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>Hi,
>
>i just want to know if there are any plans to replace upstart[1] with
>systemd[2] for 11.10?
>
>
>Cheers,
>
>Tom
>
>
>[1] http://upstart.at/
>[2] http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd
>
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>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Thu, 05 May 2011 20:23:18 +0200
>From: Francesco Fumanti <francesco.fumanti at gmx.net>
>To: Ubuntu Devel list <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>
>Cc: Gerd Kohlberger <lowfi at chello.at>
>Subject: UDS-O About onscreen keyboard - display manager - dwelling
>Message-ID: <4DC2EB16.9010105 at gmx.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
>Hello,
>
>
>First of all, I hope that I am addressing this email to the appropriate
>list and people; if not, please forward it to the appropriate place or
>inform me where I should send it.
>
>
>As everybody is probably already knowing, the Ubuntu Developer Summit for
>Oneiric is being held next week. Thus, I would like to take the opportunity
>to draw the attention to a few points of particular interest:
>
>
>1) Onscreen keyboard
>
>Browsing around, I found the following log of an irc session and would like
>to remind onboard's features for the case there will be a discussion at UDS
>about replacing it with another onscreen keyboard:
>http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/04/07/%23ubuntu-accessibility.html#t09:23
>
>- Onboard does not need at-spi to run: indeed, it is an onscreen keyboard
>suitable for pointer users (tabletpc users, disabled users,...), that can
>use it for their typing. I don't think that it is worth requiring users to
>run at-spi in order to run a simple onscreen keyboard. (Requiring an
>onscreen keyboard to use at-spi would also make it impossible to work out
>of the box as at-spi is not enabled by default.)
>
>Remark: I think that we should distinguish between users that require an
>onscreen keyboard but are able to control the mouse, and users that require
>an onscreen keyboard but are not able to use a mouse, like people using one
>or more switches to control the computer. The latter probably need an
>onscreen keyboard able to interact with the GUI like GOK, or caribou once
>it gets finished... (GOK was not good adapted for pointer users, which was
>one of the reasons for the development of onboard.)
>
>- It is usable out of the box at GDM and the desktop (if its desktop files
>were not patched by the Ubuntu dev to be hidden);it also supports the
>unlocking of the screen; for example after the screensaver has taken over.
>
>- It is possible to perform "virtual modifiers + click" actions, for
>example to do multiple selections using the shift or control modifier and
>the mouse.
>
>- The keyboard layout is defined by xml and svg files, allowing users to
>define their own layouts.
>
>- Onboard is currently getting a facelift supporting the use of themes in
>order to improve its look and making it easier to adapt to the look of the
>distribution. You might have a look at the following webpage where I posted
>a few screenshots of what is possible with the new facelift:
>http://webplaza.pt.lu/frafu/index.html
>
>
>2) Display manager
>
>I have come accross the following blueprint for oneiric:
>https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-lightdm
>
>Does this mean that LightDM is going to replace GDM?
>
>I just ran a test session in natty where I replaced GDM with the LightDM
>display manager available in the repository, but I did not get beyond the
>login screen, because there was no explicit way to enable an onscreen
>keyboard...
>
>There is already a little menu to increase the font size and set high
>contrast. Thus, I would like to ask whether this menu could not be enhanced
>with more accessibility features; maybe also turning it into a dialog. A
>starting point might be the accessibility features available in the GDM
>accessibility dialog.
>
>However, even the accessibility dialog of GDM is lacking at least one
>accessibility tool: dwelling.
>
>
>3) Dwelling
>
>GNOME and consequently Ubuntu are shipping mousetweaks, a software package
>providing the dwelling fonctionality already for several cycles, but both
>distributions are still lacking a way for dwell users to autonomly enable
>dwelling.
>
>Until Ubuntu maverick, the problem could be partly solved for the desktop
>session by adding the dwell applet to the gnome-panel. (The dwell applet
>allowed the user to enable and disable dwelling without having to perform
>any click with the mouse; it also allowed the user to indicate to the
>dwelling feature, what click type to automatically perform after the
>dwelling timeout.)
>
>What about enhancing the accessibility menu or dialog-icon so that it gets
>activated also by dwelling with the pointer on it (apart from activating it
>by a click); of course, the accessibility menu or dialog would also have to
>contain an item to enable dwelling by only hovering with the pointer on
>that item.
>
>This would solve the dwell problem for the login screen. Something similar
>would be necessary in the desktop session. For example, also providing a
>dwellable accessibility menu or dialog-icon in the panel of the desktop
>session.
>
>I can imagine that an accessibility menu might not be very welcome by
>default on the top panel of Unity, so a more subtle approach might be more
>appropriate: only show the accessibility menu or dialog-icon by default in
>the desktop session, when an accessibility feature has been enabled during
>login.
>
>I am remaining vague here on purpose because I don't want to fix the design
>of how a user can autonomly enable dwelling in a way that might not suit
>the Unity designer. The main purpose here is to offer dwell users an
>intuitive and obvious way to enable the dwelling feature by themselves.
>
>
>Cheers,
>
>Francesco
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 12:01:35 +1000
>From: "Shane.Nuessler" <Shane.Nuessler at canberra.edu.au>
>To: <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Ideas for the icon panel and menu behaviour
>Message-ID:
> <63F017FC9B34084F8D216E83F9E0184D12B4E139 at amsterdam.ucstaff.win.canberra.edu.au>
>
> 
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>Hi everyone,
>
>Been using 11.04 for a few days now and have the following ideas to
>contribute, sorry no mockups.
>
>With multiple apps of varying window sizes open, the app menu makes the
>app name go away when you use it, so the link between the menu and which
>app it's for disappears. You could prepend the app name with the icon of
>the app, and leave the icon up all the time even when the apps menu is
>displaying. That way the menu and the particular app it's for always has
>a visual linkage.
>
>
>I find the slowness of scrolling through app icons on the left panel
>rather annoying when lots of apps are on it. Getting to the one you want
>takes ages AND you can't see where it is in the list because it's off
>the bottom of the screen. Idea - The squishing of icons is a great idea
>when mouse is not on the panel, just keep them squiched when mouse over
>and as the mouse goes up and down the side unsquish the ones at the
>bottom and squish the ones at the top. That way the whole list is always
>in view, and the squishing/unsquishing will be as fast as you move your
>mouse up and down the list! And you can see where your icon is in the
>stack.
>
>
>Please make auto hide an option for the icon panel. I want to see my app
>icons and what the apps are doing. Thanks. Idea, detect the screen res
>and make a sane default based on the context of the screen res. Big
>screens default to show, little screens default to auto-hide - but is
>changeable based on taste.
>
>Shane.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: ubuntu-devel-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com
>[mailto:ubuntu-devel-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com] On Behalf Of
>ubuntu-devel-request at lists.ubuntu.com
>Sent: Tuesday, 12 April 2011 4:01 PM
>To: ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: ubuntu-devel Digest, Vol 80, Issue 20
>
>Send ubuntu-devel mailing list submissions to
> ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ubuntu-devel-request at lists.ubuntu.com
>
>You can reach the person managing the list at
> ubuntu-devel-owner at lists.ubuntu.com
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of ubuntu-devel digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Test version of Upstart with full chroot support
> available (Clint Byrum)
> 2. Re: Test version of Upstart with full chroot support
> available (James Hunt)
> 3. Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS (Dustin Kirkland)
> 4. Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS (Dustin Kirkland)
> 5. Patch Pilot Report 2011-04-11 (Dustin Kirkland)
> 6. Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS (Elliot Murphy)
> 7. Re: Default Desktop Experience for 11.04 (Scott Ritchie)
> 8. 11.10 Ubuntu Release - Call for Topics (Kate Stewart)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 08:01:00 -0700
>From: Clint Byrum <clint at ubuntu.com>
>To: James Hunt <james.hunt at canonical.com>
>Cc: ubuntu-server <ubuntu-server at lists.ubuntu.com>, ubuntu-devel
> <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Re: Test version of Upstart with full chroot support
> available
>Message-ID: <1302533777-sup-7603 at fewbar.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>Excerpts from James Hunt's message of Fri Apr 08 08:51:48 -0700 2011:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>> 
>> Hi All,
>> 
>> As a precursor to pushing this update out to Natty next week, I've
>> updated my upstart-testing PPA with Upstart version 0.9.5-1ubuntu1:
>> 
>> ppa:jamesodhunt/upstart-testing
>> 
>> Code is here:
>> 
>> lp:~jamesodhunt/ubuntu/natty/upstart/fix-chroot-sessions
>> 
>> As the name suggests, chroots should now work fully [1], but we are
>keen
>> to solicit feedback from the community.
>
>FYI, on my natty box when I was running this, installing dbus in a
>schroot
>session resulted in upstart consuming all available virtual memory and
>eventually crashing the box.
>
>Steps to reproduce:
>
>(assuming you've setup schroots w/ mk-sbuild):
>
>schroot -c natty-amd64 -u root
>apt-get install dbus
>
>
>At the 'setting up dbus' point, upstart starts to consume memory at an
>alarming rate.
>
>This is likely because the dbus upstart job has a post-start that sends
>USR1 to pid 1, which is supposed to tell it to re-connect to dbus.
>
>I believe the bug is because the USR1 handler needs to ignore requests
>to re-connect to dbus from chrooted processes, but I haven't gotten very
>deep in to debugging it yet.
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 16:11:11 +0100
>From: James Hunt <james.hunt at canonical.com>
>To: Clint Byrum <clint at ubuntu.com>
>Cc: ubuntu-server <ubuntu-server at lists.ubuntu.com>, ubuntu-devel
> <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Re: Test version of Upstart with full chroot support
> available
>Message-ID: <4DA31A0F.6060806 at canonical.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>On 11/04/11 16:01, Clint Byrum wrote:
>> Excerpts from James Hunt's message of Fri Apr 08 08:51:48 -0700 2011:
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> As a precursor to pushing this update out to Natty next week, I've
>>> updated my upstart-testing PPA with Upstart version 0.9.5-1ubuntu1:
>>>
>>> ppa:jamesodhunt/upstart-testing
>>>
>>> Code is here:
>>>
>>> lp:~jamesodhunt/ubuntu/natty/upstart/fix-chroot-sessions
>>>
>>> As the name suggests, chroots should now work fully [1], but we are
>keen
>>> to solicit feedback from the community.
>> 
>> FYI, on my natty box when I was running this, installing dbus in a
>schroot
>> session resulted in upstart consuming all available virtual memory and
>> eventually crashing the box.
>> 
>> Steps to reproduce:
>> 
>> (assuming you've setup schroots w/ mk-sbuild):
>> 
>> schroot -c natty-amd64 -u root
>> apt-get install dbus
>> 
>> 
>> At the 'setting up dbus' point, upstart starts to consume memory at an
>> alarming rate.
>> 
>> This is likely because the dbus upstart job has a post-start that
>sends
>> USR1 to pid 1, which is supposed to tell it to re-connect to dbus.
>> 
>> I believe the bug is because the USR1 handler needs to ignore requests
>> to re-connect to dbus from chrooted processes, but I haven't gotten
>very
>> deep in to debugging it yet.
>> 
>Hi Clint,
>
>Thanks for highlighting this. It actually looks like a namespace leak
>that is causing the issue - I'm investigating now...
>
>Cheers,
>
>James.
>- --
>James Hunt
>____________________________________
>Ubuntu Foundations Team, Canonical.
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>=cSt6
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>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 10:15:41 -0500
>From: Dustin Kirkland <kirkland at ubuntu.com>
>To: Thierry Carrez <ttx at ubuntu.com>
>Cc: ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS
>Message-ID: <BANLkTimXBbm=r3mv+ikftMRv7CmYUyG_ZA at mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 2:11 AM, Thierry Carrez <ttx at ubuntu.com> wrote:
>> Dustin Kirkland wrote:
>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 4:32 PM, James Troup
><james.troup at canonical.com> wrote:
>>>> I appreciate the frustration people have with gobby and I'd be happy
>to
>>>> run something better if that's what you guys want to do - the only
>thing
>>>> I'd ask is that someone package Etherpad first[1].
>>>
>>> I started with some source packages for Etherpad 1.1 I found here:
>>> ?* http://apt.etherpad.org/dists/all/source/
>>>
>>> I made a few minor modifications:
>>> ?1) used openjdk instead of sun java
>>> ?2) ported the most important subset of the (broken) init script to
>(a
>>> working) upstart configuration
>>> ?3) updated debian/control and debian/rules accordingly
>>
>> Having discussed that issue with him in the past, I think James
>doesn't
>> just want "binary packages", he wants "packages fully built from
>source
>> that could end up in the main archive".
>>
>> The "source" packages at etherpad.org use prebuilt binary blobs in
>> traditional Java fashion (see under etherpad/lib). Packaging them in a
>> Debian policy compliant way is a bit more work, like JamesPage can
>tell
>> from repackaging Hudson :) So the reason why this wasn't done yet is
>> because it's non-trivial and time-consuming, not because of laziness.
>
>Right ;-) I'll get with James Page on that, and respond to his note
>separately.
>
>>> Perhaps Jorge/Daniel could get an instance running in a beefy Amazon
>>> EC2 instance (m2.4xlarge with 64GB of memory?) and drum up an
>>> Etherpad-testing-day ASAP with your requisite 100+ concurrent
>>> sessions. ?I suspect some configuration tweaks will be necessary,
>>> which should perhaps be folded back into the packaging itself.
>>
>> FWIW the OpenStack design summit will use Etherpad with ~400
>attendees,
>> I'll let you know if it breaks :)
>
>Cool :-)
>
>Using the package built from binary blobs?
>
>Also, can you share with us the size (CPU, Memory) of the backing
>server, presumably in the Rackspace Cloud?
>
>-- 
>:-Dustin
>
>Dustin Kirkland
>Ubuntu Core Developer
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 10:28:15 -0500
>From: Dustin Kirkland <kirkland at ubuntu.com>
>To: James Page <james.page at canonical.com>, Elliot Murphy
> <elliot at canonical.com>
>Cc: James Troup <James.Troup at canonical.com>,
> ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS
>Message-ID: <BANLkTinYnYJFGmK9dJAxH91STu+HjoMz4Q at mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 12:50 PM, James Page <james.page at canonical.com>
>wrote:
>> On Fri, 2011-04-08 at 16:39 -0500, Dustin Kirkland wrote:
>>> It suffers from most the usual ailments endemic to large Java
>packages
>>> in Debian/Ubuntu. ?The debconf could use a little bit of love. ?And
>>> obviously the change from sunjdk -> openjdk needs a bit of testing.
>?I
>>> can do a complete review of the packaging as an Archive Admin and
>>> publish my notes, if we want to consider it for inclusion in Universe
>>> for Oneiric, but I haven't done so thus far.
>>
>> Hi Dustin
>>
>> I started to take a look at the bundled Java dependencies last week;
>it
>> looked like all but 3 of them could be fulfilled through existing Java
>> libraries in the archive.
>>
>> Happy to integrate this into the packaging - do you have a branch I
>can
>> work against?
>
>Sorry, I did not use a branch for this first cut, however, that is a
>good idea.
>
>You can grab my source with:
> $ dget
>https://launchpad.net/~etherpad/+archive/ppa/+files/etherpad_1.1-0ubuntu
>1%7Eppa3.dsc
>
>And debdiff that against:
> $ dget http://apt.etherpad.org/dists/all/source/etherpad_1.1.dsc
>
>I have made you an administrator of the ~etherpad team in Launchpad,
>such that you can upload iterations of the etherpad packaging to the
>ppa:etherpad/ppa. Feel free to add any other teams or individuals who
>wants to help with this work. (Volunteers?)
>
>Looks like Elliot Murphy owns the etherpad project in Launchpad -- we
>should probably hook up this team/project together. Elliot -- I also
>added you as an administrator of team ~etherpad. Perhaps you can
>transfer ownership of project etherpad to team ~etherpad?
>
>>> James, is this a reasonable starting point? ?And is there anyone out
>>> there on ubuntu-devel@ who feels strongly enough about Etherpad/Gobby
>>> to pick up this packaging/testing and take it from here?
>>
>> I would be up for this; the upstream build process is completely
>> non-standard but we should be able to work it into something more
>> maintainable.
>
>You rock ;-)
>
>-- 
>:-Dustin
>
>Dustin Kirkland
>Ubuntu Core Developer
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 13:19:21 -0500
>From: Dustin Kirkland <kirkland at ubuntu.com>
>To: Ubuntu Developers <ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com>
>Subject: Patch Pilot Report 2011-04-11
>Message-ID: <BANLkTi=GomHYkGCdnQLCTOjcVMmmoRponw at mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>As today is Beta2 freeze, I spent most of my time on:
> * https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-11.04-beta-2
>triaging bugs there, and looking for anything to sponsor/fix.
>
> * 742857
> * non-translated help documentation tweaks, reviewed, committed,
>uploaded
> * 678421
> * reviewed code back and forth with developer in IRC
> * needs-fixing, gave him a cleaner/simpler function to use
> * will revisit when he updates merge proposal
> * 717166
> * eucalyptus task invalid, but looks like there is a fix required
>against isc-dhcp
> * turns out this was fixed elsewhere, in another bug not linked to
>this one
> * 747090
> * updated triage correctly
> * 732759
> * FFe was granted on 3/15
> * Checked with developer, this was already uploaded and in Natty,
>bug just wasn't closed
> * Marked fix-released
> * 716689
> * Researched and confirmed fix has already landed in Natty
> * Marked fix-released
> * 610597
> * eCryptfs related bug, talked to assigned dev (jjohansen)
> * was milestoned against b2, but not practical to fix in that
>timeframe, so updated milestone to ubuntu-later
> * 726572
> * added cloud-initramfs-tools to uec seed
> * processed MIR archive promotion
> * 751807, 752910
> * likewise bug fixes
> * comment added to 751807, as he's using /etc/init.d/* in a
>postinst, which is not recommended, but is consistent with ~30 other
>calls in the package's maintainer scripts; I directed the patch
>author to the Debian Policy Manual section 9.3.3:
> * http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-opersys.html
> * otherwise, approved and uploaded
> * 757540
> * handled at ScottK's request
> * was kind of a pain, as the developer submitted a tarball of their
>debian packaging directory, rather than a debdiff or a merge proposal
> * also, I had to grab the upstream release tarball, extract it,
>rename the contained directory, and repack it
> * imported dsc to bzr packaging branch and uploaded
>
>-- 
>:-Dustin
>
>Dustin Kirkland
>Ubuntu Core Developer
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 14:34:49 -0400
>From: Elliot Murphy <elliot at canonical.com>
>To: Dustin Kirkland <kirkland at ubuntu.com>
>Cc: James Page <james.page at canonical.com>, James Troup
> <James.Troup at canonical.com>, ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: Re: Using something better than Gobby for session notes at
> UDS
>Message-ID: <BANLkTimg_f9XuMHks+JiUvTNtL=hmTKKig at mail.gmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 11:28 AM, Dustin Kirkland <kirkland at ubuntu.com>
>wrote:
>> Looks like Elliot Murphy owns the etherpad project in Launchpad -- we
>> should probably hook up this team/project together. ?Elliot -- I also
>> added you as an administrator of team ~etherpad. ?Perhaps you can
>> transfer ownership of project etherpad to team ~etherpad?
>
>Yep, I just happened to be the one who registered a Launchpad code
>import of etherpad back when it was released as open source, the
>Launchpad project is only used for that purpose AFAIK. I've just
>changed the administrator/owner of the project to be team ~etherpad.
>-- 
>Elliot Murphy | https://launchpad.net/~statik/
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 7
>Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:46:25 -0700
>From: Scott Ritchie <scott at open-vote.org>
>To: Martin Owens <doctormo at gmail.com>
>Cc: ubuntu-desktop at lists.ubuntu.com, ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: Re: Default Desktop Experience for 11.04
>Message-ID: <4DA384C1.5050404 at open-vote.org>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>On 04/11/2011 06:26 AM, Martin Owens wrote:
>> On Mon, 2011-04-11 at 04:22 -0700, Scott Ritchie wrote:
>>> I think it's the height of arrogance for us to tell a user that we're
>>> going to deliberately break his application because it wasn't updated
>>> to
>>> use our new indicator library.
>>
>> We tell users all the time that we've broken their windows application
>> by not implementing any windows apis. No guarantees.
>>
>
>The difference here is their application worked on a previous version of
>Ubuntu. Regressions for current users are worse than other kinds of
>problems.
>
>> So, do we guarantee completely that gnome 2.x apps will function in
>> Unity? If we do, then we should support the entire API (somehow),
>> otherwise we be honest and say we support a major subset which may
>mean
>> your app won't work completely.
>>
>> It can hardly be arrogance so long as we're honest about what we
>> support.
>>
>> Martin Owens
>>
>
>There's a difference between supporting something and not intentionally
>breaking it.
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 8
>Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 01:01:16 -0500
>From: Kate Stewart <kate.stewart at canonical.com>
>To: ubuntu-release at lists.ubuntu.com
>Cc: ubuntu-qa at lists.ubuntu.com, ubuntu-devel at lists.ubuntu.com
>Subject: 11.10 Ubuntu Release - Call for Topics
>Message-ID: <1302588076.1985.1007.camel at veni>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
>Hi all,
>
> As we go into the last phases of releasing Natty, please keep a set
>of side notes on things you would like to see improved in our release
>processes for Oneiric (and beyond).
>
> We will have a release feedback session again, early in UDS, to go
>over what worked well, and what can be improved for Oneiric. 
>However there may be some topics that are wider in scope than that
>one feedback session. 
>
>Looking at what some of the other teams are doing, a revised version of
>their process should work: 
>
>1. Send a call for topics the Ubuntu community (this is it)
>
>2. Have an exchange over irc and email to discuss the requirements in
>depth
>
>3. Produce a resulting UDS plan which summarizes the topics going
>into UDS, and feeds into blueprints
>
>4. Provide a final roadmap post-UDS
>
>
>Here is the schedule with some details.
>
>= April 12th: Request for Topics =
>This email is the request for topics. Please send topics that you would
>like the Ubuntu Release team to consider for this cycle to the
>**ubuntu-release** mailing list [1] with
>"[Oneiric-Release-Topic]" in the subject line. 
>
>These are not specific requirements, but high-level ideas or concepts.
>
>Some areas to consider:
> * Development Release Processes (freezes, testing, etc.)
> * Stable Release Updates (proposed, updates, testing, etc.)
> * Long Term Support Release Processes (testing, freezes, etc.)
> * Inter team dependencies ( Toolchain freeze, etc. ;) )
> * End of Life Processes (advance notice, transitions )
> * Release support infrastructure (archive, builders, etc.)
>
>= April 12th through April 19th - Requirements discussions held =
>We will discuss topics in the ubuntu-release irc channel and
>ubuntu-release mailing list. The goal will be to identify and
>document specific requirements.
>
>= April 19th through April 28th - Getty Natty out! =
>
>= May 2nd - UDS Oneiric Topics Review =
>A couple of days before UDS Oneiric we will present a plan. This is
>essentially a review of what topics we have planned for further
>discussion at UDS.
>
>= May 9th through May 13th - UDS =
>
>= Approximately two weeks post UDS - Oneiric Plan Review =
>About two weeks after UDS, we will revise the UDS Oneiric Plan to
>capture what was actually decided as the plan of record at UDS, and
>present that information. This info will feed into the Ubuntu Release
>planning for Oneiric and beyond
>
>Thanks,
>-Kate
>
>[1] https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-release
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
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>
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>********************************************
>
>
>
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>
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