Bradley Kuhn on switching back from Ubuntu to Debian

Aaron C. de Bruyn ubuntu-devel at
Sat Jan 16 18:09:21 GMT 2010

On 2010-01-16 at 08:22:55 -0500, Marc Deslauriers wrote:
> Well, it may not be in the notification area (which I guess is what
> you're calling the 'systray'), but how about the following, which are
> installed by default:

Yes--that's the term.  For some reason I just couldn't find it in my brain.

> - GNOME clock and the weather applet, which is by default get their
> weather data from services for which the source code may not be
> available
> - Invest applet gets stock information from Yahoo, for which the source
> may not be available
> How about all the search providers which come pre-configured in firefox?
> How about totem that has YouTube and BBC integration?
> And of course, F-Spot, which can upload pictures to Flickr, Picasaweb...

I think the real complaint is that the community chose to integrate several
search engines into FF, and they chose to integrate Flickr and Picasaweb
into F-Spot.  Same with Totem.

It appears to me that the  community didn't chose to integrate UbuntuOne
into the disto, along with its name contain 'Ubuntu'.  As I understand it,
I can't use the name 'Ubuntu' in any app I develop because Canonical doesn't
want people getting confused about Ubuntu endorsing my product or that it's
'official' in some way.  I would also have a difficult time getting my app
into main because (while the source is available) it's single-purpose
entirely for my proprietary online service.

Now personally, I don't care.  I know what Ubuntu One is, and I don't have
a need for it.  I don't care that it's installed by default.
I also have my own dpkg that conflicts with friendly-recovery, usplash,
and ubuntuone-client, along with dependencies for stuff I use on every
install.  I am fortunate enough to have an off-site server I can
rsync my data to.

I get the impression that a few people in the community view this
like the Microsoft/IE battle in the mid-90s.  Microsoft bundled IE
with Windows, and some people screamed that they were using their
position as the OS maker to push IE.

Let's be honest--if MS had used their position as OS maker to push out
Netscape instead, no one would have complained because it wasn't Microsoft
forcing their own software on people.

I think that's what you're facing, and the only way you will make those
people happy would be to remove Landscape and UbuntuOne from the default

I'm not one who is going to run screaming 'OMG' on this issue.  Canonical
is trying to support itself by having for-pay services like Landscape
or UbuntuOne.  If Canonical can't support itself, the massive
contributions to Ubuntu go away.  I would also bet that Ubuntu itself
would go away, or be significantly damaged.

You won't please everyone on this issue.


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