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Am Thu, 15. June 2006 08:14 schrieb James Laver:
[... fixed tofu ...]
> On 15/06/06, Micah J. Cowan <micah at cowan.name> wrote:
> > On Thu, Jun 15, 2006 at 02:09:56PM +1000, Peter Garrett wrote:
> > > On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 22:37:40 -0500
> > >
> > > "Christofer C. Bell" <christofer.c.bell at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > I think a 'common' folder that every user gets full r/w access
> > > > > would be great idea
> > > >
> > > > So why can't people that want it create it?
> > > >
> > > > $ sudo mkdir /usr/share/public
> > > > $ sudo chmod 1777 /usr/share/public
> > > >
> > > > Done.  Why does this need to come with the operating system's default
> > > > install?
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > > But really.... are you serious?
> >
> > Well, really. If that's so hard, surely one could use Nautilus to
> > accomplish the same? (Not that I've tried, and at the moment I'm shelled
> > out from Windows, so can't check it out). If not, I'd surely consider
> > that a deficciency in Nautilus... And if the "sticky bit" is too
> > difficult a concept, I'm sure the users that don't know about it don't
> > care enough about it to need it (especially since, the same scenarios in
> > which an "everybody" directory would be useful are likely to be the same
> > ones that are populated exclusively by "friendlies")...
> >
> > Including it as a default install option seems somewhat silly. Not
> > everyone is going to want one...
> 
> Perhaps a script can be included to make one, perhaps as a deb. I'm
> (obviously) quite happy to write the script, perhaps someone can
> volunteer to manage the deb. Naturally it would install .desktop files
> to link to it.

Only a script will not fix this on the long run.

What might be interesting is having scrips like those for an automagic 
configuration of a world read writable directory in the example-content 
folder. 
Or may be better in an example-services-setup folder. This could be a place to 
have additional scrips for automagic configuration of services like a wiki or 
others too.

This might be interesting as a step between preconfigured services during an 
installation as they are offered by distributions like RH-Enterprise or 
SUSE-OpneSchool Server or Intevation Corporate Server and the Debian/Ubuntu 
way to set up and configure every additional service from scratch. 
The Debian/Ubuntu way is not a job I would offer novice users, who are the 
primary group Ubuntu is targeting on.

The benefit I would see is that common enterprise systems offer a bunch of 
services which novice users don't need in the first run but they also offer 
single services which might be interesting for novice users to have them 
later on step by step. E.G. setting up a wiki, a local Ubuntu mirror, a ldap 
based user administration and authentication,...

So in the end it might be some kind of a scalable system which offers an ad on 
of single services which will get installed _and_ configured.

But I also see the problem of conflicting config files if every service is set 
up for its own. This will open a pandoras box for the user in the end.
May be it's an idea to bundle such a flexible growable system with an step by 
step documentation ala 'Ubuntu, from a Desktop System to a full featured 
Server' which also may be a self study base for an examination later on.



English is not my native language so my intentions might not be clear. 
For this I may explain it in German.

Ein Script alleine wird es nicht tun.

Der Ansatz per Scripte einzelne Dienste oder Funktionen nach einer 
Installation bereit zu stellen ist etwas was meiner Meinung nach zwischen 
etablierten Methodiken wie sie Server Distributionen wie RH-Enterprise, SUSE 
OpenSchool Server oder Univention Corporate Server bereits anbieten und der 
Einrichtung und Konfiguration 'from scratch' wie sie fuer Debinan/Ubuntu 
ueblich ist liegt.

Anfaenger, die primaere Zielgruppe von Ubuntu, haben in der Regel keinen 
Bedarf fuer die gesammte Fuelle der Dienste die solche Server Distributionen 
bieten. Auf der anderen Seite sind einige dieser Dienste wie z.B. ein Wiki, 
eine Lernplattform wie ILIAS oder moodle oder auch die Idee eines shared 
folders sehr wohl bereits fuer Anfaenger interessant.

Uerberlegenswert waere ob es nicht moeglich ist einzelne Dienste wie ein Wiki, 
ein LDAP fuer Benutzer Verwaltung und System Anmeldung und andere sind aber 
meiner Erfahrung nach nach recht kurzer zeit auch fuer Neulinge interessant.

Ich sehe allerdings auch die Gefahr ds solch ein Ansatz sehr schnell zu 
kollidierenden Konfiguratiins Datteien fuehren kann. Dies waere fuer einen 
Anfaenger das oeffnen von Pandoras Dose, was wohl niemand ernsthaft will.

Vielleicht waere es interessant solch eine Step by Step Erweiterung eines 
Ubuntu Systemes mit einer Dokumentation "Ubuntu, vom Desktop System zum 
vollstaendigen  Server" zu begleiten. Solch eine Dokumentation waere eine 
hervoragende Anleitung zum Selbststuium und boete auch die Chance sich auf 
eine Zertifizierung vorzubereiten.

Nicht zu vergessen das man ueber solch einen Ansatz ein bisher unerreicht 
flexibles System bekommen wuerde. Es wuerde nicht nur als Lern- und Lehr- 
Plattform fuer Anfaenger interessant sein sondern auch als Basis fuer 
Unternehmen von der Garagenbude bis hin zum Grosskonzern (Ok, Grosskonzern 
wohl nicht, aber bis zu einem durchaus groesseren Unternehmen.)

regards,
thomas