the fragile boot process [on encryption setups and home data]

Tue Mar 29 00:23:43 UTC 2016

You completely misunderstand the point of my message it seems. And then 
go and say that I don't understand stuff.

And providing such standard (wikipedia) links is just very 
condescending, you know.

If the halt-on-fstab-problem is Ubuntu related, then it is clear my 
message should have been sent here and not some other Linux distro or 
whatever.

I don't know every Linux distro, I know a bit of OpenSUSE, and of course 
some of Debian, but that doesn't imply I should be going elsewhere with 
my message, or that I have to take pains to describe what facet belongs 
to what part of the Linux ecosystem, right?.

Jeez.

You're just saying my message belongs to somewhere else so as not to 
have to deal with it, or something.

"FHS compliance is a good thing and you seemingly misunderstand a few 
things"

No, I will not be reading that document (again) and if you have any 
issue with what I've said, you can name it, and not say (by implication) 
that some other person before you has already covered it. You don't have 
to treat me like some kind of nonsense moron that doesn't know shit. The 
state of the Linux ecosystem is downright and downtrodden bad. There are 
now at least TWENTY THREE entries of folders (subtrees) in the FHS root 
of a present day (Ubuntu) system.

That spells out "BAD AT ORGANIZING" as no other thing.

It is pretty clear these people do not think about what they do. So then 
to direct me to those un-thinking people for clarity is just stupid.

There are no prizes in the computer world for architectural designs, but 
if there were, the present day FHS would not be winning it, okay?

Neither would SystemD, nor would many other things.

"Award-winning" -- you never hear that about Linux right? Right. There 
are no awards. There are also no awards recognised by other people 
outside of Linux.

Even recently the top level /run was introduced from what I know, and 
/var/run now links to it. That means the original organisation was 
BETTER unless you cater for or to some very unknown use case I do not 
know about. Just the fact that /run is not an on-disk structure and /var 
is, doesn't mean a rat's ass if /var is normally available on any and 
every Linux system to begin with.

In any well-designed Linux system there wouldn't be a /sys, /proc, /run, 
/dev, etc. etc. littering the root.

But that's apart from the issue I'm having here, and I was not getting 
into that. So I'm not sure why you are referring to it in any case. I 
was not talking about the FHS. I was talking about the location or mode 
of encryption of user-specific files.

The FHS doesn't say anything about where the actual files are located, 
it is an abstract thing. These are called mount points and you can mount 
things within the tree as much as you want.

It has no bearing, in principle, on where the user files are located, on 
what device (system) or in what form of encryption or not.

So I guess you are just missing the point completely here? Or am I wrong 
about something that I do not know? I doubt it.

"Instead of waiting that somebody customised Ubuntu to your needs, 
consider to use a more user-centric distro and set it up to your
needs by yourself. Actually you could do it for an Ubuntu install too, 
but this might be more work."

You really don't understand a thing about communication do you?

I was asking for feedback and comments, as well as getting an idea 
known. I was not "waiting for somebody customized (Ubuntu) to my needs." 
You have this lazy-man's attitude.

You don't understand that people can work together and to birth a new 
idea, or to develop a new idea, or to come up with new solutions. You 
are telling me to be an isolated person and do everything by myself. 
That is not the spirit of Linux.

And it is not the spirit of Ubuntu at all. Do you even know what Ubuntu 
means? Do you even know what its logo is?

It is people holding hands okay. Idiot.

And if this writing (now) is not exactly what I would have wanted to 
write, I'm sorry about that. My head is not very right these days and I 
often write something slightly different than what I intend.

So if you're saying "Why are you writing that?" -- no, I do not want to 
write this. It's just what comes out if I can't find the right words. 
Sorry.

It would be helpful if the majority of Linux users wouldn't spend the 
majority of their time burning other people's ideas down.

Moreover, what I have said pertains in this case (for me) to KDE. 
However, the Kubuntu ecosystem by itself is very small and there are not 
many people that care about anything. They too burn down any idea that 
differs from what they have. Nevertheless, or moreover, or all the same, 
any such idea would need to become a bit more widespread before anything 
changes anything. What can I do as a solo developer? Me, nothing. I can 
make a batch script that I have to run prior to logging in (with KDE) -- 
that is what I can do.

Of course I can pitch this to the KDE folks. But I am more tied to 
Ubuntu myself than to KDE.

Also I believe that because Ubuntu is run by some people who have 
different interests, I believe they may be less invested in a "have to 
do it the Linux way" kinda mindset. Again, completely the opposite of 
what you imply here. The Ubuntu people have a higher likelihood of being 
interested in ideas, not less.

Mark Shuttleworth himself has criticised many aspects of Linux itself, 
repeatedly, I think, or at least on one occasion I have read.

It is rare to find vocal people from the Linux world that actually have 
good ideas.

For instance, Mark talked about the OpenOffice/LibreOffice debacle, and 
gave some good insight into that issue I hadn't heard before.

Stuff other people try to keep from the public awareness.

Then, the only people who have the man-power on their own, to change 
this, might be the people from OpenSUSE.

But I'm not using OpenSUSE now and I'm more interested in something that 
might resound throughout Ubuntu/Debian.

Basically, you are directing me away from the place that I can have an 
influence, or get something done, and I'm not having that you know. 
You're basically telling me to go to the place where I am least likely 
to reach anyone.

Basically, you're just trying to disrupt what I'm trying to do. Well 
thank you very much. You know why? Because it means the idea is actually 
worth pursuing, or people wouldn't be trying to sabotage it.

So thank you for your time and your patience, your good luck and your 
good will. And kudos to you too.

;p.

And I also don't need to hear that you already consider Ubuntu (more) 
user-friendly. Why stop there? What are you in for? Who are you working 
for?

Why are you trying to kill ideas that can make stuff better?

Do you get paid for doing that or something?

Could be.

Someone is having a creative proposal and you're just trying to burn it 
down, or to get that person off the stage, or to get him to some faraway 
colony to implement his idea there where nobody can see it.

Well, again my apologies and my gratitude for your attempt, because it 
means there is something good in it.

Regards.

Ralf Mardorf schreef op 28-03-2016 13:24:
> Bart, you're confusing Ubuntu defaults with Linux.
> Ubuntu is a Linux distro, but it's not Linux.
> 
> 1. Ubuntu isn't the only distro, some distros have different defaults,
> e.g. boot not necessarily hangs, if something in fstab isn't available.
> 
> 2. FHS compliance is a good thing and you seemingly misunderstand a
> few things,
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filesystem_Hierarchy_Standard ,
> https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/ .
> 
> Even FHS compliance doesn't mean that all distros default to the same
> directories.
> 
> 3. Instead of waiting that somebody customised Ubuntu to your
> needs, consider to use a more user-centric distro and set it up to your
> needs by yourself. Actually you could do it for an Ubuntu install too,
> but this might be more work.
> 
> IMO it's already much user-friendly, if a distro doesn't follow 100%
> of the
> http://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html .
> 
> Regards,
> Ralf