launchpad +filebug redirect

Tue Sep 7 01:39:46 BST 2010

On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Mohamed Amine IL Idrissi
<ilidrissiamine at gmail.com> wrote:
> I've set up a prototype page. Please
> visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MohamedAmineILIdrissi/ReportingBugsAlternate and
> share your thoughts (especially on the TODO bits).
> Thanks,
> Mohamed Amine IL Idrissi

I quite like it. I've already made some minor tweaks here and there.

My biggest question is whether section 5 "Write a Useful Report"
should be before section 4 "File the Bug". I imagine that most people
will run ubuntu-bug in section 4 and finish the whole process before
going to section 5 - at which point it is too late to instruct them on
how to write good reports. Another option would be to merge them
somehow. Thoughts?

Evan

> On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 9:53 PM, Mohamed Amine IL Idrissi
> <ilidrissiamine at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I'm in the process of rewriting the ReportingBugs page. I'll re-post when
>> I'll have something working.
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 9:50 PM, Charlie Kravetz
>> <cjk at teamcharliesangels.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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>>> On Mon, 06 Sep 2010 17:04:38 -0400
>>> David Tombs <cyan.spam at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > On 09/01/2010 03:00 PM, Philip Muskovac wrote:
>>> > > On 09/01/2010 08:59 PM, Philip Muskovac wrote:
>>> > >> On 09/01/2010 08:10 PM, Charlie Kravetz wrote:
>>> > >>> On Wed, 1 Sep 2010 17:36:46 +0000
>>> > >>> Mohammed Amine IL Idrissi <ilidrissiamine at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>> People who are not interested in reading text already click the
>>> > >>>> link
>>> > >>>> to file a bug immediately, since there is a link to it in
>>> > >>>> ReportingBugs. Creating another wiki page would reduce the amount
>>> > >>>> of
>>> > >>>> text people would have to read, without removing the instructions
>>> > >>>> for
>>> > >>>> those who want to file good bug reports.
>>> > >>>> Adding to this, we could tell them to run "ubuntu-bug <package>"
>>> > >>>> where
>>> > >>>> <package> is found according to Bugs/FindRightPackage, or to run
>>> > >>>> "ubuntu-bug" if they are not sure, and follow the instructions.
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>> What would be ideal is that the user follow these steps:
>>> > >>>> 1. Run "ubuntu-bug".
>>> > >>>> 2. The current window opens, but with two more options:
>>> > >>>> "Application
>>> > >>>> problem" and "Specific package problem (advanced)".
>>> > >>>> 2a. Choosing "Application problem" will open a window where you
>>> > >>>> can
>>> > >>>> drag-and-drop an application from the menu.
>>> > >>>> 2b. Choosing "Specific package problem" will show a text entry
>>> > >>>> where
>>> > >>>> the user can type the package name.
>>> > >>>> 3. If the user still can't know the specific problem, an alert
>>> > >>>> shows
>>> > >>>> and warns him that filing a bug without a package is not
>>> > >>>> recommended,
>>> > >>>> with a checkbox named: "This bug is about an application that
>>> > >>>> needs
>>> > >>>> packaging".
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>> Thank you,
>>> > >>>> Mohamed Amine IL Idrissi
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>> On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 5:23 PM, Krzysztof Klimonda
>>> > >>>> <kklimonda at ubuntu.com> wrote:
>>> > >>>>> On Wed, 2010-09-01 at 17:13 +0000, Mohammed Amine IL Idrissi
>>> > >>>>> wrote:
>>> > >>>>>> Maybe we could redirect them to another wiki page that explains
>>> > >>>>>> that
>>> > >>>>>> this is not the recommended way to report a bug, and then give
>>> > >>>>>> them a
>>> > >>>>>> link to file a bug anyway, and a link to ReportingBugs.
>>> > >>>>>
>>> > >>>>> But that would defeat the purpose of ReportingBug page as most
>>> > >>>>> visitors
>>> > >>>>> wouldn't ever read it but click the link to file a bug
>>> > >>>>> immediately.
>>> > >>>>> People who have problems are not interested in reading text, they
>>> > >>>>> just
>>> > >>>>> want to get their it fixed. Unfortunately this way they file low
>>> > >>>>> quality
>>> > >>>>> reports that make our work harder and most of us are not
>>> > >>>>> full-time bug
>>> > >>>>> triagers. We already get more reports we can really deal with
>>> > >>>>> (i.e.
>>> > >>>>> triage and fix in stable release) anyway.
>>> > >>>>>
>>> > >>>>> Cheers,
>>> > >>>>>  KK
>>> > >>>>>
>>> > >>>>> --
>>> > >>>>> Ubuntu-bugsquad mailing list
>>> > >>>>> Ubuntu-bugsquad at lists.ubuntu.com
>>> > >>>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugsquad
>>> > >>>>>
>>> > >>>>>
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>> So, even though we already have the link, and people don't bother
>>> > >>> reading, you suggest another wiki page to further complicate their
>>> > >>> desire to file bad bugs? We already tell them the recommended way
>>> > >>> to
>>> > >>> file the bug, if they ignore that, why make it easier to ignore?
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>
>>> > >> The link at the top was added recently:
>>> > >> 140        2010-08-07 10:57:04     11547           oCean_
>>> > >>  Mention the no-redirect
>>> > >> url at top
>>> > >> from the launchpad page oCean_ seems to be a new user, does anyone
>>> > >> know
>>> > >> him? I don't like the link being at the top either.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Also, as I already wrote: the reporting guidelines at the +filebug
>>> > >> page
>>> > >> originally only required the user to add the application package if
>>> > >> possible, the app version and the ubuntu release they're running.
>>> > >> Many
>>> > >> happily ignored that, so why do you think they would actually stop
>>> > >> filing the bug there and click themselves through like a dozen
>>> > >> windows
>>> > >> for a kernel report? I seriously doubt they would do that.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> As for needs-packaging. The official documentation for that [1] has
>>> > >> a
>>> > >> link that uses ?no-redirect and adds the tag to the bug. Why don't
>>> > >> people use that? You can file bugs with gpg signed mails too btw
>>> > >> which
>>> > >> would be another easy way to file those IMO.
>>> > >>
>>> > >
>>> > > Actually add the reference -.-
>>> > >
>>> > > [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
>>> > >
>>> >
>>> > Well, I did not mean to start such a big discussion here; I don't think
>>> > the problem is /that/ bad, so I don't think it needs a complex
>>> > solution. :)
>>> >
>>> > To clarify my problem statement, the Reporting Bugs howto just has too
>>> > much header material. You have:
>>> >
>>> > 1) Some BOLD text which catches your eye, possibly unrelated to the
>>> > reason you came to the page.
>>> > 2) A redundant "Reporting bugs" header, which further emphasizes the
>>> > awkwardness of the bold text.
>>> > 3) A reasonable intro.
>>> > 4) Note 1 -- more distraction.
>>> > 5) Note 2 -- and more distraction.
>>> >
>>> > This is just not user-friendly. A smattering of notes and distractions
>>> > just obfuscates the real information on the page and makes it less
>>> > useful. Perhaps you don't agree with me, but in both my personal and
>>> > professional life I have found this to be true.
>>> >
>>> > If changing launchpad would be too hard, the idea of an alternative
>>> > redirect page makes a lot of sense to me. How about the following
>>> > content:
>>> >
>>> > -------
>>> > Since you've ended up on this page, you were probably trying to file a
>>> > bug about Ubuntu in Launchpad. Although filing directly on Launchpad
>>> > used to be an acceptable method of reporting a bug, using tools
>>> > built-in
>>> > to your Ubuntu system is now recommended. Please see
>>> > [[https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs|Reporting Bugs]] for
>>> > instructions.
>>> >
>>> > Thank you for your cooperation.
>>> > -------
>>> >
>>> > Disagreements welcome, but please explain why this idea would be
>>> > inferior to the status quo. Thanks!
>>> >
>>> > Regards,
>>> > David
>>> >
>>>
>>> Somehow, redirecting me to the same page I started on is not good. Why
>>> do we have to redirect the user at all. If the page is written that
>>> bad, why not suggest a re-write, instead of a re-direct. If they are
>>> going to read the new page they are sent to, they will read the page
>>> they are already at.
>>>
>>> - --
>>> Charlie Kravetz
>>> Linux Registered User Number 425914          [http://counter.li.org/]
>>> Never let anyone steal your DREAM.           [http://keepingdreams.com]
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>>> --
>>> Ubuntu-bugsquad mailing list
>>> Ubuntu-bugsquad at lists.ubuntu.com
>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugsquad
>>
>
>
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> Ubuntu-bugsquad at lists.ubuntu.com
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugsquad
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>