Dead List Walking

Tue Apr 19 22:43:52 UTC 2011

Mike,

I don't doubt that the list has been a concern for the CC for a while.
The more I think about it, the more I see that shutting it down was a
*logical* thing to do, especially in light of the fact that no
alternatives were proposed to doing so.

As for popey not being emotionally driven, I'm not entirely convinced
of that but it's irrelevant at this point and not worth debating
really. I think a better question to focus on is "where do we go from
here?"

Is the CC decision final? Is there no hope for sounder or can it still
be saved if a good plan for its governance can be proposed to the CC?
Like I said, shutting it down is logical in light of its current state
but what other options are there?

Anthony

On 4/19/11, Mike Basinger <mike.basinger at ubuntu.com> wrote:
> We were very surprised that no one showed up at the meeting to defend
> Sounder or give any possible alternatives. As this being emotionally driven
> by popey, it was not. Sounder has been an issue on the CC radar for some
> time, popey just saw that thing were not improving.
>
> Mike Basinger
>
> On Apr 19, 2011, at 4:12 PM, Anthony Papillion wrote:
>
>> I'm not sure this is all Popey's fault.  While he certainly did
>> spearhead the effort to shut down the list, it doesn't look like there
>> was a whole lot of constructive alternatives discussed and, from what
>> I saw, nobody even showed up to the CC meeting to defend Sounder. Of
>> course, perhaps someone showed up late to the meeting as I'm not
>> through the transcript yet but it looks like there was nobody.
>>
>> I'm also not sure what the purpose of reforming the Sounder list
>> somewhere else might be - or the value. While I've gotten value from
>> this list, I have to say it's nothing that can't be found elsewhere.
>> Want to discuss Ubuntu or Linux in general? There are lists for that.
>> Politics? Tech? Religion? There are lists for those too. I'm not
>> entirely convinced that a good list should or even can sustain all of
>> those topics and keep quality.
>>
>> The one thing I *can* and *do* fault popey on is that his decision to
>> propose shutting Sounder down seems to have been more emotionally than
>> critically motivated. It's even briefly addressed in the CC meeting
>> because they knew many of us would see it that way. It all just seems
>> a little to slap on the wrist for my tastes.
>>
>> Sad to see Sounder go but I suppose I can see both sides.
>>
>> Anthony
>>
>>
>> On 4/19/11, Liam Proven <lproven at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 19 April 2011 22:45, sktsee <sktseer at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Heh, my first, and last post to this list.
>>>>
>>>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil/TeamReports/11/April
>>>>
>>>> Meeting 2011-04-19
>>>>
>>>>    CC decided to close the Sounders mailing list. In essence, this is a
>>>> decision to prune areas of the project which are offtopic or ungoverned,
>>>> on the basis that they distract from our shared community focus on the
>>>> goal of delivering free software in the best possible state, on
>>>> particular terms (free of charge, cadence). While we appreciate that the
>>>> Sounders list (and possibly other, similar forums) provide a particular
>>>> social release for those who use them, we think there are better forums
>>>> for each of the varied topics discussed there. Some of those are inside
>>>> the project, most are elsewhere.
>>>>
>>>> Transcript of IRC meeting log here:
>>>> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/04/19/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> sktsee
>>>
>>> "We finally really did it. You maniacs! You blew it up! Damn you. God
>>> damn you all to hell!"
>>>
>>> Thanks a ******* lot, Popey, you ****** ******* *******.
>>>
>>> Do folk think there's any point starting our own mailing list to
>>> replace Sounder or should we just disband?
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Liam Proven • Info & profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven
>>> Email: lproven at cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lproven at gmail.com
>>> Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419
>>> AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lproven at hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508
>>>
>>> --
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>>> sounder at lists.ubuntu.com
>>> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/sounder
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Sent from my mobile device
>>
>> Anthony Papillion
>> Lead Developer / Owner
>> Get real about your software/web development and IT Services
>> (918) 919-4624
>>
>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/cajuntechie
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>>
>> --
>> sounder mailing list
>> sounder at lists.ubuntu.com
>> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/sounder
>
> --
> Mike Basinger
> mike.basinger at ubuntu.com
>
>
>
>
>

-- 
Sent from my mobile device

Anthony Papillion
Lead Developer / Owner
Get real about your software/web development and IT Services
(918) 919-4624

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/cajuntechie
My Blog:   http://www.cajuntechie.com