Mr. Shuttleworth gets quote mined (and probably should blog to clear this up)

Scott (angrykeyboarder) geekboy at
Thu Jun 21 12:03:54 BST 2007

[quote cleaned up and reformatted (as best I could) for consistency]

W. Scott Lockwood III spake thusly on 06/20/2007 06:39 PM:

> On Tue, 2007-19-06 at 21:35 -0300, Derek Broughton wrote: 
> I swear, I'm going to just create a rule to bounce emails regarding Ubuntu. 
> This doesn't happen on any other lists I read, but it happens on all three
> Ubuntu lists.
> The problem is that the Ubuntu lists are inconsistent from one to the other.
> On some the reply address is the list.  On others it's not.
> Since there's no consistency, it's easier to just click "reply to all"
and let
> the dice fall where they may.  Were there some consistency across
lists here,
> a lot of this would sort itself out.

>> Particularly since someone (Derek?) complained that the other list wasn’t a place
>> for that kind of general chat, but said that sounder was….
>> And is now complaining about it. On Sounder. J

IMO, those complaints are both valid. And while we're on the subject of
complaints.... think of the following not so much as complaints, but
helpful hints. :) :

	1. Unless a mailing list *specifically* states that HTML is acceptable
(or encouraged), please do *not* post to a mailing list with HTML (as
you did here).

	Why not? Well just for starters, many Email clients can't read HTML
messages (this is especially true in the world of Linux/Unix/*bsd, where
console-based software -e.g. the Mutt Email client- is very popular).

	It is *very* difficult to properly quote a message that was posted in
HTML. I had to play around with this reply quite a bit to make it
halfway sane.

	2. Please take the time to learn to the conventions/traditions of the
list you are posting to (one does this by lurking for a while before
posting). On most lists and newsgroups (sane ones anyway - sounder would
be among those), replies are put at the bottom of the message (not the
top as you did), which enables one to easily follow the thread
(conversation) regardless of what message s/he's reading from it.

	"Top Posting" vs "Bottom Posting" will probably always be never-ending
debate. I myself prefer the latter, but my best advice is to go with
what is the most common on the list or newsgroup you are in (although I
myself don't take my own advice in this instance ;> ).

	3. Try to only quote relevant text. Trim as much as you can while still
"making sense" in your reply.

	Signatures are not relevant. Most good email clients (Microsoft Outlook
has *never* fit into this category) will snip signatures automatically
when you reply.  So in the case of Outlook, you need to do this manually.

	NOTE: I snipped the signature you had quoted in your reply, in my rely
to you..

And speaking of text that is not relevant...:

> From: sounder-bounces at
[mailto:sounder-bounces at] On Behalf Of Michael T. Richter
> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 8:35 AM
> To: Ubuntu Sounder
> Subject: Re: Mr. Shuttleworth gets quote mined (and probably should
blog to clear this up)

...most definitely qualifies (IMO) as being not relevant.

And speaking of my opinion.. :)...

I'm always amused when posts from Microsoft Outlook show up on Linux
mailing lists. :) They practically *scream* "Hey, I sent this with
Microsoft Outlook, see!!!!"

For the record (unless otherwise stated) these opinions just aren't my
own. I learned this from years of participation on mailing lists and
newsgroups (OK, I lied, I've been on lists for years, but I learned this
stuff within a moth or two from when I first began participating).

Do a Google search on "mailing list netiquette|etiquette" and you'll see
links to oodles of pages covering what I've said here (and then some).

Of course, the message you're reading now could be considered a "flame"
(which was not my intent) which is bad netiquette as well. However, I'm
actually trying to be helpful and (I hope) reasonably polite about it. :)

Thanks for your time.


©2007 angrykeyboarder™ & Elmer Fudd. All Wites Wesewved

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