Update to the Community

[Ryan Gauger]

What does all of this have to do with the original email?

On May 30, 2012, at 6:12 PM, "Juan R. de Silva" <juan.r.d.silva at gmail.com> wrote:

>> People have different online habits. Those who began their Internet
>> journey adopted one set of habits, largely informed by the norms of the
>> then-popular Usenet community. Some of these habits probably had to do
>> with the limited storage space and narrow bandwidth of the times.
> 
> While it mostly true that the mentioned habits originated in mentioned 
> "then" realities, it is also true that these habits aimed usability, 
> meaning the time spent on reading and responding in first place. And this 
> is probably the main reason why these habits outlived their original 
> constrains and successfully migrated to new realities.
> 
> Increased storage space and bandwidth do not mean people are ready to 
> spend their personal time "fishing" for the actual poster's message 
> between all HTML tags.
> 
>> Naturally, these people
>> brought their behavior to the Internet when corporate networks and the
>> Internet converged.
> 
> It might be very natural for them but it is not necessarily natural for 
> the community they just joined. See for the main reason above.
> 
> IMHO, when people join a new to them community and look for assistance 
> from its members, it seems to be also natural to respect time and efforts 
> of those who they are expecting to provide such assistance.
> 
>> Personally, I straddle both worlds. But I don't think it's right to
>> expect everyone to do that. Kvetching on lists about the "proper" way to
>> format messages is likely not to result in the desired behavior changes.
>> In fact, it comes across as elitist and alienating.
> 
> Well, first of all, it's not quite right to use words like "kvetching". 
> This DOES "comes across as elitist and alienating".
> 
> If you read my post again you'd see that I just suggested that posting in 
> HTML was actually the best way for "alienating" a significant portion of 
> the community that is capable and would be willing to provide an 
> assistance.
> 
> And BTW isn't it true that the existent posting etiquette does suggests 
> not HTML formatting as a PROPER one?
> 
>> If Windows 8 turns out to be the disaster that the prognosticators
>> appear convinced it will be, a certain percentage of Windows exiles
>> might find their way to Kubuntu. Some of these might also find their way
>> to this email list. They will bring with them habits gained from years
>> of doing things the Windows way. Are these habits in some manner wrong?
>> No, of course not. They're just different.
> 
> With you permission, I would strongly disagree with you on this. 
> 
> Consider a simple example. People used to drive along the left hand road 
> side in UK. Some of them comes to another country where cars move along 
> right hand road side. Imagine now he/she would attempt to keep his/her 
> habits...
> 
> Would it be "just different"? Or would it be wrong? 
> 
> You see, "just different" at times can be just wrong.
> 
>> We, then, are faced with a
>> choice: we can either welcome them to the wonderful world that is
>> community-driven free software, or we can drive them away. Let's not
>> drive them away.
> 
> Agree with every single word.  
> 
> But let welcome them by helping to understand how Linux community in 
> large lives and why it is for their own benefit to accept and to adapt to 
> certain "habits" of this community. 
> 
> Yes, we can certainly "welcome" them by not letting them know about 
> existence of a posting etiquette. But wouldn't it be wrong?  Wouldn't it 
> mean alienating them instead?
> 
> Is it really the best way to welcome newcomers by slowly eroding the 
> community etiquette.
> 
> 
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