internet connection on Kubuntu Hardy

Emanoil Kotsev deloptes at
Thu Oct 16 18:01:21 BST 2008

Thorny wrote:

> On Wed, 15 Oct 2008 08:01:06 -0700, Emanoil Kotsev wrote:
>> It's kubuntu Lisi, not you! Don't give up!
>> That's why I have forced the discussion here recently. People who know
>> debian, would also know what it means unstable. Just polishing it and
>> offering it to the masses is not enough for the pure user and at the
>> other hand the major target of kubuntu are the pure users. I still do
>> not understand this controversy.
>> I'm still pleading that kubuntu devs should get a stable system for
>> users who have windows level of computer knowledge aka no knowledge in
>> computers at all. k/ubuntu has the potential but still lacking the will,
>> making it easier for people with computer knowledge to do the job done
>> but failing to win the pure home user.
>> I've fixed the k/ubuntu installations of all my friends who are not
>> willing to pay licenses to MS and I know what I'm saying. I also took
>> them the root/sudo rights and they are very very glad - me too ;-)
>> regards
> Well Emanoil, you just recently mentioned in another thread that you
> didn't want to discuss that issue any further. It's not going to make you
> any friends in this community if you lurk waiting for some opportunity to
> interject the same stuff every chance you get. I imagine there are some
> who have already plonked you and thus don't see your posts, and though I
> haven't done that I really don't want to see the same "policy" argument
> brought up too many more times when it has all been said.

Yes you right. It's much much better than debian sid. But the apps are not
stable  enough. I still don't know for sure if  I'm satisfied. For me
something is working when it's working 95-98% of the time and for few
things it should be 101% (like kernel and disk stuff)

May be I want to discuss even if people "plonk" me - I'm still not
100%sure - am I kubuntu software :-). There will be someone who reads the
stuff and even if not, I still like to write it down.

> Sure, Kubuntu is *based* on Debian Sid (unstable) but Kubuntu is not
> Debian unstable, developers have worked to make it much easier to use than
> Sid and I think they are very successful. Do you think that "pure" user
> you mention would have a good user experience if they tried to install and
> run Sid? Does everything about Kubuntu work flawlessly for people who
> don't know what they are doing, no, not *everything*. Would Debian have

That's what I'm saying. kubuntu targets people with less experience. Instead 
of fixing kde 4.X bugs it might be better to give the users a more stable 
kubuntu and working system.
Debian is not targeting those people, so when you go to debian you know what
to expect from them. When you go to kubuntu you are told a great linux
distro, also for people without linux knowledge - and those people fell on
their nose.

> worked with the specific wlan card that Lisi has, not necessarily. What if
> it is a broadcom chip, would it have worked on Debian stable (currently
> Etch) out-of-the-box, no because of the non-free drivers and I haven't
> even mentioned old version vs. new version. And, just because your wlan
> card worked, one can't assume all would or even *should* work without user
> intervention.

Of course not, but as you see an average kubuntu user can not manage it and 
even I had troubles with the networking stuff, but fixed it quickly.

> BTW, when you "fixed" the K/ubuntu installs by removing sudo, many people
> would characterise that as *breaking* the system. Not everyone shares the
> same opinions and GNU/Linux gives us a lot of opportunity to choose and
> the freedom to do so. You don't need to tell us you know what you are
> saying, we realise that is your opinion.

I removed them as users from the sudoers file and did not remove sudo as a
hole. I put myself there, so the next time they have troubles and forget
their root password I'm able to help them. At the other hand without sudo
they can not break anything and it's proven to work. If I have to visit one
of them every day, I wouldn't have time to spent an evening at home. So
they write down when what has happened and occasionally I fix the most of
it at once - once or twice a year.

Still my wish is to have a stable k/ubuntu system working for pure users and 
the discussins proves that many do think so.
I don't care if it's based on unstable or experimental, but if kubuntu aims
to target pure users more has to be done


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