[Fwd: PXE is proprietary - what the heck is it doing as the default LTS install in Edubuntu or Ubuntu?]

Jane Weideman janew at hbd.com
Mon Jun 5 10:12:58 UTC 2006


-------- Forwarded Message --------
From: C. CatherineCapers <cccapers at yahoo.com>
Reply-To: cccapers at yahoo.com
To: janew at hbd.com
Subject: PXE is proprietary - what the heck is it doing as the default
LTS install in Edubuntu or Ubuntu?
Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 12:25:36 -0700 (PDT)

Hi Jane,

Congrats on 6.06... 

Only it is TOO BAD that you are using PXE...,  instead of the LTSP
supported and recommended ETHERBOOT, for LTS clients to talk to the LTS
Edubuntu Server!

Here are some quotes from Disklessworkstations tech support as I tried
to get them to support Edubuntu with their bootable network cards.

"We do not provide network cards with PXE only Etherboot. PXE is
proprietary and requires a license to sell".

""The method describing how to create a
Etherboot'able kernel would be run every time there is a Ubuntu
kernelupdate to keep the kernel current".

So - when are you going to release a default kernel fix to Edubuntu and
get rid of the proprietary PXE stuff?  Soon I hope.

It is my understanding that cooperation broke down between the *buntu
folks doing LTS and the LTSP teams... and that the LTSP teams are saying
that the *buntu LTS folks have taken some wrong turns and it seems that
one of them (by not listening to their LTSP elders) is the default
support of PXE instead of Etherboot.  It's no wonder that their LTS
stuff only will support PIIs and 48 MB RAM as a suggested client!  Why
didn't they do what the LTSP.org folks suggested?

Best regards,

Camp Catherine Capers

Content from previous email to you...

Jane Weideman <janew at hbd.com> wrote:
... that we needed to go thru the lists to submit the below
suggestions... well I don't have time... so - I emailed back to you that
you should pass this along to Mark... some of your guys in dev are
ignorant of any suggestions made from logical postions.
        
        On Wed, 2006-03-08 at 07:05 -0800, C. CatherineCapers wrote:
        > Hi to all at Edubuntu,
        > 
        > Sorry I am not going thru channels... but, I feel that these
        need to
        > be broadcast to you all by email. I hope you all get a chance
        to see
        > them. Edubuntu has so much promise that I would hate to see
        the below
        > missed for the Dapper April 20 relase date.
        > 
        > 1- Gwenview - in the testing I have done on the Flight 4
        install...
        > Gwenview is still missing the free plugins (that SuSE has
        built in
        > already). It is a real problem for any user to figure out how
        to get
        > them and install them on their own. 1 plug-in allows for a
        easy way
        > to take a photo attachment sent to an auto starting email
        client (can
        > choose on the fly which one) and this tool also resizes the
        photo to a
        > "web-email" friendly size ----- all with one click, the email
        starts
        > up the resized attachment is part the NEW email ready to go
        > (Evolution).
        > 
        > 2- A very important discovery... is that for some reason I can
        not
        > get any Ubuntu, Edubuntu, Kubuntu to work in VMWARE Linux
        Guest, where
        > the CLOCK time does not lose about 8 hours of time every 24
        hours.
        > VMWare has a fix where they talk about this here as to why
        this is
        > happening. It seems that it is just with the 2.6 kernel this
        problem
        > appears. See:
        > VMWARE PAGE about CLOCK problems with LINUX, 
        >
        http://www.vmware.com/support/kb/enduser/std_adp.php?p_sid=xt1o2SZh&p_lva=&p_faqid=1420&p_created=1093994398&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9ncmlkc29ydD0mcF9yb3dfY250PTEyOCZwX3NlYXJjaF90ZXh0PWd1ZXN0IHRpbWUmcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT03JnBfcHJvZF9sdmwxPTM3JnBfcHJvZF9sdmwyPX5hbnl_JnBfc29ydF9ieT1kZmx0JnBfcGFnZT0x&p_li=
        > 
        > It seems that this is a LINUX problem as I don't have a
        problem with
        > WIndows VMWare Guests.
        > I have figured out a way to get this to work for Fedora
        K12LTSP, and
        > somewhat works half the time with SuSE 9.3 (Gains time does
        not lose
        > time)! BUT - since I use VMWare (Windows Host) in testing
        variuos
        > LINUX guests, and in an ACTUAL deployment where I can use 3-4
        NICs in
        > one box and have 3-4 different LTSP environments running to
        different
        > locations (different buildings even with Fiber optic bridge
        direct
        > from a fiber optic LAN card to the other building and not via
        switch
        > (the Fiber NIC in the SERVER requires Windows drivers -so one
        needs
        > VMWare Windows HOST and run Linux as a guest in order to pull
        this
        > off)! 
        > 
        > The reason for the differnet VMWARE LINUX LTSP installs on 1
        server,
        > and the need for VMWare is found in the following
        case /examples of
        > how this sever is used to run differently used LTSP working
        > environments: 1st- the primary VMware LTSP guest install is
        used
        > in the Office for general office work and has certain
        applications on
        > it (no need for any games etc, just business apps)... a 2nd
        install is
        > for staff access and that is used for general staff use for
        their
        > purposes (different than the office so that the applications
        they have
        > access to are much different and more custom to their needs,
        can also
        > use this to show off LINUX to mostly summer college staff
        where they
        > can play all the games, play with photo tool GIMP, and more...
        note
        > that MOST of these staff are going to go on to become teachers
        when
        > they leave college so this is the 1st exposure to LINUX and I
        want to
        > make it a good one, but have 6 workstations P200s 32MB RAM as
        LTSP
        > clients and can not afford new computers to let staff use
        computers
        > for only 2 months of summer employment... we tell them to
        leave their
        > laptops at home as I don't want to deal with MS issus and
        helping them
        > at all with those problems for free)! 3rd - One additional
        plus is
        > that this 2 working LTSP install environgment works for
        security needs
        > as well as any sites or apps that they use are not run on the
        same
        > VMWare Guest session as the office one is run on... and if
        there is
        > any problems with either I can fix it without having to both
        to shut
        > the other one down. Saves money as the Server has enough CPU,
        RAM and
        > Drive space to do the 2 different LTSP enironments via VMWare
        on one
        > box... this so with VMWare don't need another server for each
        needed
        > LTSP server need.
        > 
        > 3 - Flight 4 - Live CD of Ubuntu, Edubuntu, Kubuntu all on a
        Dell
        > Latitude C800 laptop shows 3 screens overlapping and it is
        impossible
        > to use. This problem did not exist with Breezy at all as the
        Ubuntu
        > Live CD works fine (but slower than other live CDs)
        > 
        > 4- Edubuntu-Lite - what is relation ship with Xubuntu? Note
        that
        > there should be 3 names for any released "LITE" version....
        > Edubuntu-Lite-128, Edubuntu-Lite-64, Edubuntu-Lite-32 - All
        with
        > differnent install defaults according to amounts of RAM, Speed
        of
        > Processor, and Hard Disk Size. The Goal of any
        Edubuntu-Lite-32
        > version should be to equal or better the ideas that Damn Small
        LInux
        > or Puppy Linux put forward.... Both of these will run on low
        RAM,
        > small HD, etc... BUT-They don't have provision for long term
        install
        > with the all important UPGRADE FEATURE and SECURITY UPDATES
        > features... that one needs in order to prevent having to
        reinstall ,
        > reinstall, reinstall... all expensive when it comes to labor
        and time
        > cost for any school or organiztion.
        > 
        > 5 - Note - Edubuntu-Lite-32 could be a foundation OS for LTSP
        client
        > as well for such things as LOCAL multi-media, LOCAL VOIP,
        maybe for
        > USB and other devices on the client, etc... and other funtions
        that
        > when put on a "shared CPU" at an LTSP server have "slice
        sharing"
        > issues that affect performance for the user... and for all
        users as a
        > result.
        > 
        > 6 - Is Edubuntu default install going to require 2 NICs like
        K12LTSP
        > does. It should but I see nothing of this direction in the
        Flight 4
        > information? An Edubuntu LTSP install should require the 2
        NICS, by
        > default, as this is much easier to install this way.... and it
        makes
        > sense that one does not have to go thru the hassle of adding
        the 2nd
        > NIC after the fact, because installing a 2nd NIC for operation
        that is
        > like K12LTSP (out of the box, so to speak), is just so much
        easier to
        > understand and it works fine in K12LTSP installs. 
        > 
        > 7- Another general LINUX problem - bu true for Multi-user LTSP
        as
        > well... is that to make room on a hard drive that is filled up
        one has
        > to remove TMP files (K12LTSP.org collects these thing and the
        it seems
        > that when the staff download phtos that are sent to them onto
        their
        > desktop, that a copy ends up as a TMP file and these REALLY
        GROW
        > quickly. I have yet to understand and find ONE CLEARLY
        > understandable way to delete these files using a Graphical
        Interface
        > (in fact, I don't think there is a system level GUI available
        for a
        > usre or administrator to clean these up. Can the be delected
        for a
        > use anytime a user leaves a session, or by some Sudo GUI
        enabled
        > "choice or configuation GUI app" for Delete of uneeded TMP
        files? I
        > have posed this question on many LINUX help pages and I get a
        ton of
        > different answers (ALL COMMAND LINE) that are complex and
        certainly
        > will be nothing that your target SCHOOL or Library Edubuntu
        user or
        > enrty level admin is going to be able to understand.
        > 
        > 8 - Of course for Schools, and Libraries, for educational DVD
        and
        > other digital works, there is a need for running LEGAL
        multi-media in
        > PCs! There was some news the other day I read where Linspire
        may
        > make CNR available for legal Multi-media for Ubuntu? Wow... !
        > However, most schools would need to go thru purchasing for
        this and a
        > subscription model might not work for them and the way things
        get
        > budgeted. Schools are also used to a price discount for
        Schools as is
        > offered by Microsoft! Many need an invoice and the item has to
        go
        > thru channels that don't work well with a CNR pay automatic by
        credit
        > card payment process. I think that if Linspire is going to be
        able to
        > play a part in getting legal multi-media to schools that there
        needs
        > to be a "BOXED VERSION with a retail sales type of billing and
        > delivery method". This is how purchasing at alot of schools is
        set
        > up. Any arrangement that Ubuntu makes with Linspire should
        take the
        > need for just a boxed retail version of legal multi-media to
        be
        > offered for sale in a traditional retail box format. Other
        users of
        > Ubuntu might also want this as well, vs a regular CNR
        subscription !
        > Most might think that they just want Legal multi-media with a
        certain
        > number of years of support for it.
        > 
        > 9. - Also note FYI that per a discussion with Corinex Sales
        > (http://www.corinex.com/web/docx.nsf/w/eng-products ) that
        their
        > networking bridge over POWER LINES (came out prior to HomePlug
        AV)...
        > they say will do 80-110 Mbps over power lines and I am
        wondering if
        > this is enough to do LTSP sessions over? If so, then wiring
        OLD
        > SCHOOLS up could be easier to do? Maybe. I am talking with
        them
        > now about getting a couple of these for an old small library
        that has
        > these old PCs and I am telling them about LTSP. The problem
        with this
        > school is that they also have OLD wireless and that is too
        slow to run
        > LTSP on. SO - we shall see, but if the Corinex stuff works for
        LTSP
        > that could help some schools that might have building problems
        with
        > the rewire needs.
        > 
        > 10 - I am wondering if I can get Edubuntu CDs for up to 40
        Schools
        > around here that I need to deliver to the different schools
        around
        > when Dapper is released. I took K12LTSP CDs around to them
        before...
        > however, I have discovered that the OFFICIAL looking RETAIL
        like
        > packing and CD printing of Ubuntu CDs goes over to the people
        who I
        > give them to better than handing them a CD that looks like a
        regular
        > burned CD with Magic Marker writing on it. I also sent the 3
        > different Ubuntu CDs to the state's Joint Senate and House
        Legislative
        > Committee on Technology that is headed by a fellow who is a
        retired
        > school employee (former sports coach and has taken many credit
        hours
        > of continuing education with computers) and is now the
        chairman of
        > the committe. Of course sending these out to as many as is
        possible
        > might make an impact over time. The budgeted number of CDs per
        > country is limited. Hmmm- have you figured a way around this?
        Maybe
        > a percentage of Linspire CNR sales could be kicked back to the
        > Edubuntu CD production budget (and advertised as such when and
        if the
        > deal with Linspire happens)?
        > 
        > Hopefully - for the edubutnu specific parts above that this
        all can
        > be looked at, and addressed, in the time before Dapper is
        released. I
        > was hoping for some improvement in the Flights, per these
        issues, as
        > they went along, but have not see it yet... so, I decided to
        send this
        > email. 
        > 
        > Keep up the good work
        > 
        > Best regards,
        > Camp Catherine Capers
        > 
        > 
        > 
        > 
        >
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        -- 
        JaneW
        _____________
        Jane Weideman
        mobile: +27 83 779 7800
        Canonical Ltd.
        
        



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-- 
JaneW
_____________
Jane Weideman
mobile: +27 83 779 7800
Canonical Ltd.






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