<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
</head>
<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>for information - specifically the end :)<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-forward-container"><br>
<br>
-------- Forwarded Message --------
<table class="moz-email-headers-table" border="0" cellspacing="0"
cellpadding="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap">Subject:
</th>
<td>Re: Ubiquity Proposal - Add "minimal" setup with kernel
parameter</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap">Date: </th>
<td>Tue, 25 Jul 2017 12:46:42 -0400</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap">From: </th>
<td>Mathieu Trudel-Lapierre <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:mathieu.tl@gmail.com"><mathieu.tl@gmail.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap">To: </th>
<td>Carl Richell <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:carl@system76.com"><carl@system76.com></a>, ubuntu-devel
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com"><ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap">CC: </th>
<td>Ubuntu Desktop Discussion
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com"><ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com></a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<br>
<br>
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_extra">
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jul 11, 2017 at 11:31 AM,
Carl Richell <span dir="ltr"><<a
href="mailto:carl@system76.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">carl@system76.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p
id="gmail-m_569394815413223320docs-internal-guid-36cb6ec4-3245-7462-753b-d817433027be"
style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt" dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">System76 would like to
use GNOME Initial Setup for user
configuration. Currently, there is duplication
with Ubiquity.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<div><br>
</div>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">We propose changing
Ubiquity to add a “minimal” mode, triggered by
a kernel parameter (a flag similar to how OEM
install is triggered now). This enables
flavors to use whichever version makes sense
for them. System76’s Pop!_OS and the
elementary OS team are interested in using
“minimal”. Minimal might be attractive to
Ubuntu w/ GNOME as well.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<div><br>
</div>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">“Minimal” will contain
the least amount necessary to install the OS.
We also prefer off-line installs with minimal
which would remove options to download updates
or install 3</span></span></span></span><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:6.6pt">rd</span></span></span></span><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt"> party software during
install. This requires adding language packs
to the iso when using minimal.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Why could this not be a variation on the OEM install
type instead? Installation can proceed as usual, but
presumably you don't already know the name of the user
you're installing for. In all install cases you'll need to
at least take the steps of picking a language and keyboard
mapping for the installer (in case you need to also enter
other information, such as the OEM ID we ask for to
differentiate OEM install batches, crypto password,
network authentication to reach a mirror, etc.). The
difference is that when you do an OEM install, you do the
file copying phase, reboot into an "OEM preparation"
environment, so that you can do any further customization
of the actual setup (pre-installing some software that
wasn't done automatically, checking to make sure
everything is as it should, etc). Then you can tell the
system that everything is ready, and reboot into the
"real" system customization phase that is done by the end
user: user name, hostname, timezone, and all of that jazz.
Doing so via oem-config or GNOME Initial Setup could just
as well be a decision left to the OEM provider.</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">Minimal screens:</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">Welcome/Language Select
- change: add KB Layout [1]</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">Installation Type -
change: move hostname here [2]</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">If full disk encryption
is chosen, Choose Security Key screen.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<p
style="line-height:1.2;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">--Timezone: we’d like
to remove timezone but Ubiquity is crashing
when we do so. More investigation is
necessary.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<div><br>
</div>
<p
style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">[1] KB layout currently
comes after “Installation Type”. Users can’t
set their layout before typing a full-disk
encryption password. Moving KB layout forward
would fix this. However, Ubuntu uses the first
Welcome Screen to display both language and
“Try Ubuntu” or “Install Ubuntu”. A couple of
ideas:</span></span></span></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I don't question the need to move the keyboard setup
earlier, it just never got to the top of my priority list.
That said, there's already an easy workaround, you can
choose exactly what keyboard mapping you want before you
pick "Try" or "Install" if you booted in BIOS mode (I
know, that doesn't work in UEFI yet). We'll get to fixing
this eventually (sorry!).</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<p
style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"
dir="ltr"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320highlight"
style="background-color:transparent"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320colour"
style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320font"
style="font-family:Arial"><span
class="gmail-m_569394815413223320size"
style="font-size:11pt">[2] Hostname is
currently on the “Who are you?” screen. It
uses the username and DMI information to
populate the hostname. We propose using the
same DMI information, adding 4 hexadecimals to
the end (a checksum of the MAC address
“Galag-Pro-A8F3”), and moving the hostname up
to the “Installation Type” screen. This
enables “minimal” installs to set the hostname
and business customers can install the OS on
multiple machines, with automatic or custom
hostnames, then give the computer to their
user for account setup.</span></span></span></span><br>
</p>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>What would setting the hostname earlier actually bring
as a benefit? You can already set automatic/custom
hostnames as an enterprise policy via preseeding or via
DHCP. For factory systems, it seems to me like there is no
benefit in setting any hostname at all (or if there is,
please let me know); it's a user decision what they want
to call their machine. In an enterprise setting, I would
usually not expect people to use an OEM-type install (even
your 'minimal' proposal), but rather preseed the
installation parameters and only leave to users the few
decisions that would make sense -- in an enterprise
setting, this often doesn't even include the username.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Making users further go through GNOME Initial Setup
should already be possible by configuring the final system
via a preseed (ie. install the right package, but the
right files in so it starts when you log in).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>My concerns with this are mainly that many of the
"advantages" listed in the design document [1] for Initial
Setup are already covered by ubiquity as far as I can tell
(speed of install, being able to do unattended installs,
etc.); with the benefit that it's not tied to any
particular desktop environment: ubiquity (oem-config)
should work just as well for any desktop environment,
without requiring the use of GNOME software (some flavours
may not want to use some, for various reasons). We let the
end user make customization decisions as late as possible
so that we don't block the installation unnecessarily
while the user picks a hostname or username. In my
experience that tends to fit nicely in the time it takes
to complete the file copy (but otherwise, you're not
blocking the end of the installation much either).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I'm all for improving ubiquity by removing code
duplication, doing a big cleanup in that monstrous
codebase, and simplifying the installation process in
general, but right now it seems to me like GNOME Initial
Setup would only solve this for a fraction of our users. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Could you come up with a code branch that does what you
want and knows to install GNOME Initial Setup, or with a
pre-made image that mocks up how you see things, so that
we could play with it?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As for the flavours, aside for Kubuntu where shipping
Initial Setup would be bad (take up more space on their
image and look very odd); how do you feel about having
such an Initial Setup step? How would it look?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[1] <a
href="https://wiki.gnome.org/Design/OS/InitialSetup"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://wiki.gnome.org/Design/OS/InitialSetup</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>/ Matt </div>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>