I wouldn't move the panel at all. That is one part of Xubuntu that makes it unique. Instead I would just add some text in the installer to tell them it can be customized and moved to their liking. I usually show ms people the ease of which it can be moved and leave it at that. Just like the libreoffice note on the 13.10 installer seems sufficient to tell everyone that other products can be installed. 14.04 beta seems pretty solid and a lot of the minor things have been cleaned up and fixed making it the most solid release yet. Thanks <div class="gmail_quote">On Mar 22, 2014 10:39 AM, "Paul" <<a href="mailto:lentonp@gmail.com">lentonp@gmail.com</a>> wrote: <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> To really capture the Microsoft crowd, the panel should probably be positioned at the bottom by default. I've introduced many MS users (XP end of life worriers, or computers too old to support the millions of updates) to *buntu, and the biggest objection I hear about the XFCE desktop is that the "start button" isn't where it's expected. Regarding the issue of LibreOffice vs AbiWord, AbiWord runs very well from memory but I agree that LibreOffice is a much better full package. Would it be possible to add a button under the Office application group that has two functions, depending on whether you're on live or disk install? 1. On live the button should link to some screenshots/a small slideshow presentation of LibreOffice to show people what they can get once it's installed. 2. Once xubuntu is installed to disk, that button would remove AbiWord and install LibreOffice. There could also be an option under it to remove the prompt, for the users that were happy with AbiWord. That way you can see/do everything on the live boot, but the final install is much more powerful and MS friendly. <div>On 21/03/14 20:57, PK wrote: </div> <blockquote type="cite"> <div dir="ltr"> <div> <div>Well, a very important step in the good direction has been the introduction of the Whisker menu and the single desktop bar in 14.04. But the default office applications are still underpowered and feel "cheap". It's so cool to have LibreOffice by default..... It's a selling point of great value: "look, even from the live session you can not only use Firefox, but also a full-fledged Office suite, comparable to Microsoft Office." </div> In my opinion, that would be the last step needed to position Xubuntu as *the* cool, professional alternative to the "song and dance" of other desktop environments. More immediately attractive to business users as well. But not only to business users: many consumers like elegant simplicity, too. Provided it's packing all the valuable right stuff by default. Deep blue, full power. </div> Regards, Pjotr. </div> <div class="gmail_extra"> <div class="gmail_quote">2014-03-21 21:23 GMT+01:00 Eero Tamminen <<a href="mailto:oak@helsinkinet.fi" target="_blank">oak@helsinkinet.fi</a>>: <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi, On torstai 20 maaliskuu 2014, Lutz Andersohn wrote: > <html> > <head> > <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" > http-equiv="Content-Type"> > </head> > <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> > <div class="moz-cite-prefix">I am taking Elfy's advise replying to > Pjotr: > Your mail client/settings are broken, it's sending HTML. > I think I agree with the LibreOffice suggestion (and the "first > impression"-sentiment) but for a different reason: I think Abiword > and Gnumeric are just fine for everyday needs They fit well on install disk, start faster, use less memory, have better performance at run-time too and IMHO also look better. But if you need to work with other people using MS office, they aren't really compatible enough. One problem is just file compatibility, another one looks of the documents: different font metrics and sizes, differences in styles etc. More complicated documents don't look quite right and if you edit them, their styles get messed up. > but I can see a lot > of users who would want to make slides "out of the box", so they > need Impress. It would be nice if those users had that capability > w/o having to install Libre. That's a good point. > Alternatively, a button would be nice that is labelled "To install > Office Software click here" which then goes out and installs > Libre. I think many of the XP migrants we expect might be > technically capable to install Libre from the Software Center - if > they only new it existed! Since they usually don't know its there, > frustration might arise (When I started using Ubuntu/Xubuntu, > installing an app was easy once I found out there was one! the > hard part was finding it and deciding between the different > options) IMHO this would be good solution. Wording of such button/icon may need some fine tuning though, e.g. "Install MS-office compatible office suite" or "Install full Office suite". Best would be if it would invoke some Software Center introduction which tells new users how to install extra software (besides LO). - Eero -- xubuntu-devel mailing list <a href="mailto:xubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com" target="_blank">xubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com</a> <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel</a> </blockquote> </div> </div> <fieldset></fieldset> </blockquote> </div> -- xubuntu-devel mailing list <a href="mailto:xubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com">xubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com</a> <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel</a> </blockquote></div>