Proposal: include gnome in xubuntu

[Jani Monoses]

Gauvain Pocentek wrote:
> Oops sorry, it's already happening.
> 
> I didn't react until now because I thought the "discussions" were
> useless, but I think I care too much to be totally quiet (well, I did
> care at some point, not that much now).
> I'm sorry to see this distro turning into a Pseudo Ubuntu with bits of
> Xfce, after having spend so much time working on it, trying to make it
> different and lighter.

It is lighter. I am not sure why users would want it different. Xubuntu 
was primarily about being a lighter Ubuntu using Xfce. That is still 
true today. It is definitely ligher and can be very close featurewise.

I am sorry you too mix developer-only PoV into what should be mostly 
user oriented. What most users will care about is working apps not 
necessarily Xfce labeling, so chosing the latter when it has drawbacks 
it is ineffective.

I don't see why you think adding apps which do not affect anything 
besides neing in the menus are wrong? Xubuntu is supposed to be light 
not minimalist. There's a difference.
Lightness is resource related and we all experience it so the lighter 
the better.
Minimalism is more of a philosophy and it is preferred by experienced 
users. It has no technical sied to it, it is a matter of prefenece.
I think these two are often mixed up in our discussions and bloat as in 
resource abuse is mistaken for bloat as in too many installed apps.
Newbies will want as many useful apps (one per cantegory) as possible.
Experienced users may want minimalism. the latter category can more 
easily get what they want than the former so we cater, as Ubuntu, to new 
Linux users.

> 
> Sorry to not provide constructive ideas or proposals to solve the
> problems, but I don't see how I could bring something new or useful when
> all the efforts made by Lionel and Jérôme has been treated like crap
> (sorry if "crap" is not CoC compliant).

I am sorry that you see it this way. It's ok to use 'crap' btw, I do not 
mind :)
I still do not see how J&L's work is treated like crap. Their work on 
packaging and bugs and their idea of what Xubuntu should be are not the 
same thing. Otherwise you could say my previous work is treated like crap.
We cannot have any change in distro leadership turn into treating users 
like crap. So their work is still here, but I wish they hadn't spent too 
much time on squeeze and fixing other apps when their time is limited.

Jani