<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 TRANSITIONAL//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; CHARSET=UTF-8"> <META NAME="GENERATOR" CONTENT="GtkHTML/3.10.2"> </HEAD> <BODY> Karl, it's been nice reading your emails and you made some really goods points. I have always been a windows user, I tried Linux about two years ago (installed it) and wiped it the next day, I tried last year and the same. It just wouldn't work well with my hardware, I mean I know it's never going to be perfect but it could at least take me to the point of good functionality and then I could use the Internet and mail lists to get help in making it perfect. I suffered years of grief and misery with all versions of windows, from the temperamental crashing, viruses, updates and intrusions with all the time spent restoring from a backup. This became a way of life and didn't seem so bad. I installed Ubuntu about 4 months ago, I got the internet working in it and spent hours and hours reading web pages, blogs, wikis and forums on configuring parts that didn't work well. At one point I nearly gave up. Then I remembered that although maybe I have spent three sleepless nights trying to get my sound working, how many months of sleepless nights did I have "using" windows when the machine wouldn't even boot and I would have to baby sit it through the night as it recovered from backup CDs. Not forgetting to mention the countless reinstalls of Windows, but when you finished installing windows that wasn't half the story. You still had to locate a copy of Office, install basic antivirus tools, firewalling, spyware, malware, image manipulation utilities. Graphics drivers, sound drivers, printer drivers, mouse drivers, keyboards drivers, hard drive drivers the list is endless. Now reconsider: did you really give Ubuntu a fair trial? I ask you to please reconsider, having read the wiki articles suggested by others, get yourself the Ubuntu CD and try a fresh install. If the system is even half working after finishing the installation then Ubuntu is doing a helluva lot better than windows. Get your network working, and then you can write emails to us and we'll help you get the rest working. There are ways to do everything under Linux it's just a question of knowing what tools you have available and how to use them. I have been using Linux now for 4 months so I am no pro but things are making more sense and I have a pretty good idea of the system. It is possible to make easy backups and deleting is even easier (sometimes too easy!). If you get the system installed then I know one of us can instruct you on how to make these possible, even me. Gabe On Sun, 2006-07-09 at 13:45 +0200, Karl J=?ISO-8859-1?B?5A==?=rnhammer wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE> <PRE> On 2006-07-09 11.52 Ouattara Aziz wrote: >> My conclusions are that Ubuntu, at least, is not for Newbies > > I agree with you on that point, Ubuntu isn't, at least for now, for > newbies or one who doesn't want to learn. But I think the community is > working on improving the easy handling of Ubuntu. And for it, I think > the community needs user like you, who will propose projects to improve it. > As for your problem, I would have help you if I could but just like you > I find Ubuntu network configuration tools very incomplete ( I mean it's > cool that sometimes it runs "out of the box" but the time you get a > little problem, take vim, and edit your configuration. That can really > scare newbies). I don't think I am particularly naive. My first computer was a Mac back in 1984 and I stuck with them until last year which explains my lack of computer savvy. The reason I emigrated to a PC was that Mac had moved on again with their OS system to OSX and my G3 was considered inappropriate to upgrade, at the same time ADSL became available in my area but only for a PC they said (I know better now)! I was offered a cheapish PC which my daughter said was OK and so I went with that, an XP proffs version. I had quite a few months of grief with all manner of malware invasions and crashes but eventually got things sorted to the extent that it became a useful tool again. But, 99% of the work (and fun) I have on it are based on Firefox, Thunderbird, Open Office and a few other programs that are not dependant on the Windows platform. I have always 'loved' the Linux idea but when that opportunity became available I considered myself to be too busy to get involved and hey - I had a Mac! Then someone suggested Ubuntu as a 'free' alternative. And so I downloaded a Live CD and I burned an Installation CD to check it out. Then XP crashed again (not such a big deal as I have learnt from experience and have recent back ups - my Mac goes back to 84 though and is still intact, that says quite a lot I think) and so I saw an opportunity to switch over and you know the rest.... > So, Karl do you have any proposition about how to improve this side of > Ubuntu ? I think it would be really interesting to have it. I am not really sure that my suggestions can be valid as I failed so dismally that I have no idea at all why I couldn't get started. But, when I was downloading Ubuntu I was definitely under the impression that it was indeed 'plug and play' (downloading from ubuntu.se - I think). Right there it should have said 'Newbies - read this before proceeding' and directed new recruits or the curious to the sites I have now been given (too late I am afraid) by Peter Garrett of this list (thank you Peter), namely: <A HREF="https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation">https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation</A> <A HREF="https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsDualBoot">https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsDualBoot</A> <A HREF="https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MigratingFromWindows">https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MigratingFromWindows</A> <A HREF="https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingFromWindows">https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwitchingFromWindows</A> Had I started there instead I would have hopefully avoided much grief. I didn't even look for these as I really thought it was ready to go. Another thing I would like to mention is that in spite of all manner of installation wizards even these are sometimes difficult to understand for the uninitiated as they often use 'jargon' and terms which do not necessarily translate easily and logically into the users language. Even a little thing like a roll down menu which include POP but does not mention POP3 whilst at the same time offering a multitude of unheard of alternatives - got me worried for a start. I mean if POP3 is the same as POP why call it 3? And if it's not the same why isn't it on the list? And if I select POP having been told I have a POP3 account and nothing else - will it work or should I give up right there? I remember my daughter was installing DC++ for me and I asked her why she was doing what ' I don't know' she replied!' 'So how do you know what to do?' I asked. 'My friend Linda has it set up like this..........' Oh well....... Raldz mentioned that his 3 yr old son enjoys Edubuntu, well, I bet he didn't install it himself ;-) But I am of an age now when I have difficulty in remembering how to program my steam powered video recorder for goodness sake - and I don't have very high hopes that things will improve on that front either as time goes by :-( What I would really like to be able to do is: Press a button that backs up everything and saves it somewhere. Press another button that erases everything. Bung in a CD which installs an OS of my choice and retrieves anything from my back up that is not on the new OS, opens itself and confirms that everything is OK and 'have a nice day'........... It should do this of course in the time it takes to drink a cup of coffee and it should be free in the context 'no money involved' - now, is that too much to ask? Best wishes KJ PS. I will be baaaak :-) </PRE> </BLOCKQUOTE> </BODY> </HTML>