[OT] get rid of OT

Oliver Grawert ogra at ubuntu.com
Tue Oct 4 12:39:20 UTC 2011


hi
Am Freitag, den 30.09.2011, 20:24 -0700 schrieb rikona:
> Hello Oliver,
> 
> Friday, September 30, 2011, 5:58:59 AM, Oliver wrote:
> 
> > if people think its a waste of time
> 
> I think you may be misinterpreting this quite badly. As you can see
> from the current discussion, there is LOTS of interest in this topic.
> The problem is in how you are forcing people to participate. Most
> folks have a life besides sitting in front of the screen JUST when
> they MUST be there to participate.

i was commenting to liams post where he wrote: 
"IRC, for example, as you repeatedly
invite us to participate in IRC meetings - is to others a tiresome,
irritating waste of time."

please dont pull my words out of context...

> 
> > to show up at the only place that can make decisions about the
> > future of this list (again, no canonical involvement here...),
> 
> If you want more participation [and it seems as though you really
> don't, the way it is structured] then it would be MUCH better to do
> the communication via an email list like this. Then, when someone gets
> back from a 3 day business trip [the session you insist he must attend
> took place while he was half way to Europe on an airplane], that
> person can contribute to the discussion. If you do it this way, it
> would seem likely that you would get a lot more participation [which
> it seems you do not want].
why are you blaming me for an infrastrcuture i didnt set up ? 
i dont want more participation and i dont want less participation. 
there is a process thats in place since 7 years now (which i didnt put
in place and i find it pretty offending that you accuse me for its
failures or that i would push anyone to anything). 
if people want to express interest they have to show up at the place
where they can be seen, very simple fact.

if your city decides to build a dump yard in your street, will you and
your neighbors sit around and moan about the fact that you cant do
anything about it because your governmental system doesnt allow you to
stop it by moaning about it to your neighbors or will you go to the next
communal meeting where the topic is being discussed to get that decision
revisited ?

> 
> > then it doesn't seem to be worth at all to keep it running ...
> 
> Many, including me, are reeeeeeally wanting to keep the list!!! Do you
> not get that?
sorry, but you really get offending, i'm probably one of the first 100
people that ever subscribed to this list, i'm one of the few canonical
employees and ubuntu developers still left on this list, i read it daily
and usually give support at least once or twice a week, what do you
think, do i look like someone who has any interest to shut that list
down ?

[... snipped more blames and vague assumptions ...]

> Set up a mailing list for that process...
feel free to suggest that at the next CC meeting ...


note that i wont answer any further mail followups to this mail, posts
like this make me wonder if the effort i (and others like alan or paul)
put into keeping that lists alive (which includes that i invested 30min
of my rare spare time to show up at each of the meetings discussing it)
shouldnt be left to the other one or two persons that actually try to
keep it alive in the CC meeting discussions.... being attacked rudely
based on weird assumptions isnt actually motivating ...

ciao
	oli





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