Forget Hardy

[Peter Garrett]

On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:41:42 +1000
"Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs at gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> Perhaps I can expand on this: I have personal issues with various points
> about Ubuntu, some of them involving earlier disatisfaction with Debian
> regarding kernel compiling and installing packages from upstream source.

I think that's understandable from the viewpoint of a Gentoo user. The
mindset is quite different, and for example compiling a kernel "The
Debian Way" probably makes Gentoo users squirm. Installing from
upstream source works fine, but requires that the user be familiar with
Debian tools ( like 'apt-get build-dep' , for example, and the
development packages)

> Earlier on, however, Debian distros---I used Knoppix alot, just to make the
> install easier---always didn't hold together for me: the complicated
> packages did not work!

I also came to Debian through Knoppix, originally. Knoppix was never
intended as a hard-drive install, as Klaus Knopper himself often said.
For example, a dist-upgrade from a Knoppix install was pretty much
guaranteed to break, and Knoppix used a mix of stable, testing and
unstable, which is close to heresy from a Debian viewpoint. :)

> But Ubuntu seems to have solved almost all of those
> problems!  How do I know, maybe Debian has too.  

In my experience, "pure" Debian had few problems, and was generally rock
solid - even Sid, which is supposed to be "unstable", rarely caused me
problems. Originally I moved to Ubuntu because I had a sound card that
was not yet supported under Debian - and I've been here more or less
ever since, but part of that was also an agreement with the aims and
philosophy.

> I have had some rough
> spots, however, where I was seeking help, and I could not find help with
> them.  I suspect most of the fault is my own, for I have not grokked the
> Ubuntu way.  

Someone will probably pull me up on this - but as far as I can see,
technically the Ubuntu way and the Debian way are practically
identical. Experience with Debian has served me well with Ubuntu. This
is hardly surprising of course :) Thus, a reading of for example the
"apt howto" is equally applicable with Ubuntu.

Your comments about the excellence of Gentoo documentation are in my
opinion true, but a lot of Gentoo documentation is very Gentoo-specific.
This is also true of documentation for Debian-based distros of course. 

I think the issue with both "Debian" distros and Gentoo is that both
have quirks. In many ways I think that Slackware is the "purest" distro,
because it allows the user to do more or less anything that Debian or
Gentoo allow, but in a more "traditional" manner. With both Gentoo and
Debian-based distros, there is a set of utilities and commands that are
particular to that distro - much more so than Slackware. The thing that
is attractive about Debian distros, at least for me, is the brilliant
packaging system and the policy behind it. Gentoo of course has its own
system that works superbly for its devotees - but you really *need* to
be a devotee :)

-- 
Peter Garrett <peter.garrett at optusnet.com.au>
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