Thoughts of late.

Brad Luyster bradluyster at gmail.com
Sun May 27 02:12:47 BST 2007


The problem with schools is twofold:

First, with Public Primary and Secondary schools, they have policies
in place that govern what can and cannot be used.  Generally, anything
on the front-end must be based on windows because those are the
applications the state has contracts with.  On the back end, things
are more flexible, but most of the local sysadmins aren't smart enough
or are too ingrained with the microsoft ideal to be able to switch to
Linux:  Switching to Linux means you forfeit all state support for
your servers.

Post-secondary institutions are generally more receptive to these
ideas, and a lot of them are already using Linux on the back-end.  The
server people aren't the ones you'll have to convince at colleges.
The independent academic departments are the ones you have to appeal
to.  Computer Science departments aren't a good target because they
will usually have Linux machines already, and can't switch entirely to
Linux because they have to teach their students how to program windows
applications:  Not doing so would be academically negligent.  Business
schools are bad targets as well.  They want to teach their kids
whatever is in the market:  Business education is primarily
reactionary.  Once Linux is on the desktop in business, business
schools will teach it.

Other departments, it will depend on the Internal IT guy and how much
computers are used.  It has been my experience that 90% of the IT guys
out there are completely incompetent, and use whatever skills they
have to hide their incompetence.  The majority of the rest don't want
to learn anything new, and the majority of the rest of THAT don't want
to bother with it because they're lazy.  You'll also encounter IT guys
that are just irrationally anti-Linux.

Basically, what I'm saying is that businesses and schools aren't very
good targets in general.  Those conversions hinge on the willingness
of the IT guy, and generally they aren't very willing.  We will have
far more luck if we push for the average user that wants something
different or better or cheaper.

Zupht0r

On 5/26/07, Chance Gooch <l337600ch at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey, I'm Antimatter Redneck.
>
> I'm not very active, and even a Newbie to using Linux in any form, but I
> hate Windows with a PASSION, even though I really can't completely get rid
> of it due to the systems I work with at my school, but me and x626, and some
> other friends are trying to get our school to go over to Ubuntu, instead of
> XP and Vista, and might have some luck next year, and I'll be trying to
> distribute Ubuntu Linux CDs during my summer at EKU, where I take a few
> classes during the summer. I think getting local Comp. Techs to install
> Ubuntu as an XP or (especially) a Vista substitute is a GREAT Idea! I'm good
> buddies with several of the local Techies here in Lincoln County, and even
> have a pal working with a communications company (They're changing so much
> now I no longer know what network he works with) and I am trying to get all
> of them to covertly switch over to installing Linux as a Vista or XP
> replacement.
>
> I recently got ahold of a bunch of Edubuntu CDs, and am thinking of donating
> them to my school system so that the Techs can put Edubuntu on the
> elementary school computers as they get new ones. They've already promised
> at least one or two Linux-run Dell computers in our High School Library
> Media Center next year, so they're starting to transfer over, but it'll be
> tough.
>
>
> On 5/24/07, Adam Senn <aesenn at gmail.com> wrote:
> > This is true.  A CD distribution point would still be quite beneficial;
> but to play devils advocate, what's "in it" for them exactly?   They are
> indeed in their business for the money, and perhaps they would view a free
> completing OS would interfere with their existing business model of charging
> for XP/Vista installs.  Hopefully, we would be able to find some good
> stewards of humanity, who are willing to forgo the Microshaft monopoly; I
> would.  I still believe coming up with a viable "local" Ubuntu model would
> be our best option, with an ancillary CD distribution point alternative.
> >
> > I believe the acceptance the general public will have that comes with a
> locally supported OS may (or may not?) prove to further the Ubuntu cause.
> It depends on the consumer perhaps.  I'd like to see us strive for the local
> business model option.  It would be more accepted, if it was profitable over
> the long term and if it fails with a vendor, ask that they allow us to
> distribute CDs through their storefront.  Either way, it would be a winning
> deal for the FSF and its variants.
> >
> > I'm just spouting ideas here.
> >
> > Adam
> >
> >
> >
> > On 5/24/07, Eric Lake < ericlake at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > > Hash: SHA512
> > >
> > > There may still be the option there to get them to be a distribution
> > > point for the CDs. That and we could let them know that we can offer
> > > some support to those that are already running or plan to run Ubuntu.
> > > There really would not need to be a business model for that I think. It
> > > is just really letting them know about the community and our team.
> > >
> > > Adam Senn wrote:
> > > > more random nonsensical dribble...
> > > >
> > > > We would have to somehow adopt a business model for the local Ubuntu
> > > > vendor,
> > > > that would mirror that of Canocial; distribute Ubuntu CDs and install
> > > > options, become Ubuntu certified, and profit off of some kind of
> local,
> > > > onsite support mechanism.  Vendors could offer onsite tech support,
> and the
> > > > Ubuntu KY LoCo team could handle the limited support offerings you
> mention.
> > > > If the support business model works for Canocial, it can work for
> local
> > > > vendors too.
> > > >
> > > > I'd assume it would still be a grassroots effort, and they may not see
> a
> > > > real incentive to make the initial Ubuntu offering.  We need to show
> that
> > > > there is a demand, as in the case of Dell users on the Ideastorm
> website.
> > > > IMHO, this change in vendor attitude needs to happen in order for
> Ubuntu to
> > > > grab hold in any community; i.e. visibility and local onsite support.
> The
> > > > Dell offering really helps such an initiative.
> > > >
> > > > I think as far as group activities are concerned, it would prove
> beneficial
> > > > for several people to solicit individual local computers vendors
> onsite
> > > > (KYTrade is in my sights); you know mafia style! (kidding); and show
> the
> > > > local Ubuntu Business model.  I believe there MUST be a replacement
> revenue
> > > > stream if we are to suppose replacing Windows products with free
> > > > alternatives.  Otherwise, they could be hostile towards the idea.
> > > >
> > > > On 5/24/07, Eric Lake < ericlake at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > > That isn't a bad idea. We can even offer (limited) local support for
> the
> > > > customers that buy with that option. They may even be willing to be a
> CD
> > > > distribution spot. We have over 300 CDs that we need to be able to get
> > > > into the publics hands before they are obsolete.
> > > >
> > > > Adam Senn wrote:
> > > >> Just an idea to consider....
> > > >
> > > >> Has anyone given thought to asking local computer builders, such as
> > > >> Kentucky
> > > >> Trade, if they would offer installing Ubuntu as an alternative to
> > > > Windows
> > > >> XP/Vista?  This would be a great way to get Ubuntu into the
> mainstream
> > > > on
> > > >> the local level.  Using Dell as a leading example will go a long way
> in
> > > >> convincing them to offer it as an alternative, or those looking for a
> > > >> cheaper solution.
> > > >
> > > >> I thought about talking to Freddie at KY Trade about this, however I
> > > > feel I
> > > >> probably couldn't do the subject justice.  Plus, we have to justify
> the
> > > >> benefits for the vendor, when offering Ubuntu takes away an already
> > > > steady
> > > >> revenue stream from XP/Vista installs on new computers.
> > > >
> > > >> On 5/24/07, Eric Lake < ericlake at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>> Dear Members of the Kentucky LoCo team,
> > > >
> > > >>> I have been doing some thinking about the team lately. We are
> > > >>> currently at 64 members according to the launchpad page. I know that
> > > >>> some of you are mostly on the forums and don't use irc much. Others
> of
> > > >>> you are more irc and less on the forums. Still others of you do a
> > > >>> little of both. Thats cool.
> > > >
> > > >>> At this time we are having irc meetings every Thursday night at
> 8:00PM
> > > >>> EST. Is this too often? Should we move to an every other week
> > > >>> schedule? Or even once a month (this may not be often enough
> though)?
> > > >>> We are averaging around 15 members at the meetings (that does not
> > > >>> include the bots). That is a big difference from the 64 members
> > > >>> mentioned before.
> > > >
> > > >>> So far we have done a few events (Install Fest and Release Party).
> > > >>> What are some of your ideas for other things to do? How can we
> spread
> > > >>> the word about Ubuntu in our area more effectively?
> > > >
> > > >>> It is my belief that this needs to be a whole team effort and not
> the
> > > >>> work of a few. We have started some sub-teams to handle some of the
> > > >>> things that need to be done (Wiki Web, etc.). There is still a lot
> of
> > > >>> work that needs to get done too. We have a team web site now but it
> > > >>> needs some work to make it rock. We would like to start a team blog
> of
> > > >>> what is happening with Ubuntu in Kentucky and get it syndicated to
> > > >>> planet.ubutnu-us.org.
> > > >
> > > >>> Please contribute where you can.
> > > >
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Thanks,
> > > >
> > > >>> Eric Lake
> > > >
> > > >>> --
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> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>
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> >
> >
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> > ground." Thomas Jefferson
> >
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> >
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> Never let Rednecks play with Antimatter, we never know when to say "Hey
> y'all, that's 'nuff!" it's always "Hey y'all, watch this!"...
>
> And then someone's truck is usually blown up.
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