proposed-migration blocks for milestones

jackyu at jackyu at
Fri Sep 6 06:24:18 UTC 2013

Hi Steve & Scott, 

If it does slow down the development,  it's fine to stop freezing Ubuntu Desktop in our Alpha releases. However, we hope there are several frozen days for our Beta releases.

Jack Yu
UbuntuKylin Team
At 2013-09-06 12:37:15,"Scott Kitterman" <ubuntu at> wrote:
>On Thursday, September 05, 2013 20:31:19 Steve Langasek wrote:
>> Hi Scott,
>> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 06:25:28PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote:
>> > > Finally, there's one other point that I think we should discuss
>> > > regarding
>> > > the opt-in freezes.  The current model for opt-in milestones is that we
>> > > freeze all those packages which are used by any of the opting flavors. 
>> > > I
>> > > don't think this is in the spirit of the original compromise that was
>> > > proposed, however - particularly since two of the flavors that have been
>> > > doing opt-in milestones, UbuntuKylin and Edubuntu, are deriving directly
>> > > from the ubuntu desktop seed, with the result that for beta-1, all of
>> > > Ubuntu Desktop was frozen.  I don't think this is a reasonable outcome;
>> > > the Ubuntu Desktop team are explicitly *not* participating in these
>> > > milestones in order to maintain development velocity, and it's not fair
>> > > to them to have flavors that are "downstream" of them imposing a freeze
>> > > on their work.
>> > > 
>> > > I think it's fine for Edubuntu and UbuntuKylin to participate in the
>> > > opt-in
>> > > milestones, but we shouldn't freeze the Ubuntu Desktop packages for
>> > > this.
>> > > They can choose to freeze the packages that are part of their overlay,
>> > > but
>> > > where the Ubuntu Desktop packages are concerned, there should be a level
>> > > of
>> > > trust in the CI methodologies that we have put in place for the Ubuntu
>> > > Desktop itself, instead of freezes whose effect is to reduce alignment
>> > > between Ubuntu and the other flavors.
>> > 
>> > I guess a lot of that revolves around the question of how people feel
>> > about
>> > releasing install media with obsolete packages on them.  We've gotten more
>> > relaxed about that in recent cycles without any problems I'm aware of.
>> > 
>> > OTOH, part of the reason for uploading to proposed was to allow teams to
>> > continue to work through these things.  I don't understand how two days of
>> > not migrating has any significant affect on development velocity.  AIUI,
>> > the benefit for non-participating flavors is that developers don't need to
>> > stop their normal work and test/fix issues associated with the milestone.
>> > The larger effect on velocity comes from what people spend their time on
>> > and not on if a package migrates from -proposed or not.
>> Having packages frozen in -proposed still negatively impacts velocity,
>> because nothing in -proposed is being used by the developers and other
>> users; a full development iteration means the changes need to reach the
>> release pocket, where they can be used by developers and other users,
>> incorporated into images, and subjected to additional image-based
>> integration testing.
>> It certainly helps to be able to upload to -proposed instead of not being
>> able to upload at all, but the milestone freeze does still slow down
>> development.  And in this context, I think it's an unnecessary slowdown.
>Perhaps.  For those packages that are part of the CI environment, it might 
>make sense to whitelist them from the block process.  I think this won't be a 
>problem again until the Alpha series for "T", so there is some time to 
>determine which packages or the criteria for selction to be exempt.
>At the very least, I think there should be some agreement among the affected 
>products about the relevant package list.
>This is probably a good topic to flesh out at the next UDS.
>Scott K
>Ubuntu-release mailing list
>Ubuntu-release at
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