Hai I have a thought about it, I don't really agree with this election thing.. One thing about election is, the better you talk and the better social skills you have, then you will be a leader.. even if in reality, there are more people spending all their time working for the community.. But these people are boring geeks, they don't organize BBQ instead they spend their time replying emails to people who asked for their help.  Election is all about, how many you know instead of how much you have contributed. Atleast, this is true in Malaysia. I hate politics , most of the politicians are just good at making promises and finding/spotting other people mistakes. They are good at making people think they are angels, while the current leaders are Devils.  Most of them don't care about the people, they just lied so that they can rise to power and when they rise to power, you will realized how much of what they said before were nothing more than lies so that they can be at the top... I am sorry, but I don't wish to have politics or politician here... The kind of leader that I dream of is a leader with a proven background, a background in helping the people... I am stubborn person, I am no longer gonna be the leader of this group, and it has already have much problem.. But I do not wish to see it being a complete destruction... I might not be a good leader and I learned a lot from my experience and pretty much tell me what kind of person should lead this group.... I founded the local group, that something you can't deny.. I am not boasting.. but that's fact... as a founder,  I don't want to see what I started being destroyed, I am willing to go because I think I am not good enough or have enough experience to lead this group anymore, and I wish someone who is more experienced to lead the group and not someone who is popular but lacking in term of experience and knowledge and skills of a leader.. I am going to come out with the list of people who have been contributing and supporting Ubuntu for the past few years.. they are not popular people, but they are old and experienced enough to lead the group...  I normally don't use my power to decide, but this will be the first and the last for me.. For the good of this community... Zarul <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 20, 2008 at 9:29 PM, Syamsul Anuar <<a href="mailto:anuar@vastalux.com.my">anuar@vastalux.com.my</a>> wrote: <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> Salam / Greetings All, Zarul, Thanks for all your contribution and we respect your decision. Its time for the new leadership to take your legacy and move forward the Ubuntu Malaysia community towards better tomorrow. I for one suggest there should be an election for new leadership, complete with some campaigning as I think the Malaysia general public nowadays dont embrace "peralihan kuasa" (read: something got to do with Pak Lah.. ) but a fair and democratic constitution is the way forward. I will always lend my support to my beloved Linux Community. Regards, -wariola- On Thu, 2008-06-19 at 17:10 +0100, <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com</a> wrote: > Send Ubuntu-my mailing list submissions to >       <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >       <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >       <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > You can reach the person managing the list at >       <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-owner@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-owner@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Ubuntu-my digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >    1. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (Donald P Kong) >    2. Re:  Ubuntu-my Digest, Vol 18, Issue 4 (Pepper Lim) >    3. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (Nicholas Ng) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 19:07:48 +0800 > From: Donald P Kong <<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a>> > Subject: Re: [ubuntu-my] Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians > To: Malaysian Team Mailing List <<a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a>> > Message-ID: <1213873668.5988.16.camel@thinkpad-x61> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Zarul, > > ?it is sad to see you go. hopefully, you will re-consider your > stand. ?maybe it would help for you to know that not all in this group > are merely opportunists looking to make a buck out of Linux. i hope that > would make you remain as the leader. > > ubuntu-my is not the only list suffering "commercialisation" issues. as > i see it, most people join this and any other linux communities to look > for opportunities and answers. once they get their answer or see no > money to be made, they move on. few are willing to contribute in helping > others which is what the FLOSS is all about. in our own local > activities, it is nearly impossible to get volunteers to show up. > > most malaysians see Linux as a big chance to make money since it is in > demand and as long as potential customers cannot find alternative > sources of assistance, they're locked into one vendor thereby ensuring > continued income. > > > Altaf, > > ubuntu-my is a community of Ubuntu users and would be targeted > specifically at ubuntu users. i don't quite understand the suggestion of > "working under a bigger malaysian user group". i would believe most of > the members here are also members in other general linux groups as well. > > i agree that Linux users should not be "fighting" Microsoft. instead we > should concentrate on promoting the usage of Linux on desktops. the only > way that we can effectively do this if we were users ourselves. only > then can we know the downside of Linux and how to work around it. then > in time, new users will realise how much better Linux is and then make > their choice. > > personally, i am a Debian user but my mother, wife and children's > computers/laptops are using Ubuntu. it is a much more "friendlier" and > "easier" Linux to promote. > > > > > > On Thu, 2008-06-19 at 08:32 +0800, Altaf Jauhar wrote: > > ubuntu-my should be working under bigger malaysian user groups such as > > MyPenguin99. Alot of users under the group are ubuntu users... splitting > > into another group is not good. we need to coperate and team up to > > create a larger group. devide and we'll fall. combine and we'll grow. > > > > ahh... zarul..... you should just continue to be the leader... a person > > who started it should be the leader... coz you have the real spirit and > > understand the true meaning of creating the group in the first place. > > > > btw, we should not fight 'microsoft' anymore..... it is more like linux > > and microsoft will co-exist whether we like it or not. microsoft have > > been doing alot of changes lately... and one of it is to 'accept' linux > > and oss. that's why if you see projects like mono have not yet been > > 'banned' from the scene. > > > > honestly, i'm not a fulltime ubuntu nerd.. i'm more of a slackware nerd. > > but, i think ubuntu is cool and is the best thing a non-geek can get his > > or her hands on - if he/she wants to give linux a try. he'll/she'll be > > running linux in no time.. and enjoying it. 1 more thing, it must not > > just be ubuntu. it should be including all its variant: kubuntu, > > edubuntu, xubuntu.... coz not all ppl will like gnome (i'm a xfce and > > kde guy myself). > > > > ok. thats all for now. > > > > regards, > > he]ix. > > > > > > > > zarul shahrin wrote: > > > How sad, I think I am no longer have heart for the community, I am > > > proud that I founded the group and built it from zero, well, we might > > > not be as active as the group from other countries but getting this > > > far is already beyond my expectation. Anyway, this group is getting > > > bigger I will let people who are more active like  Nicholas, mypapit > > > and e-jat to take over the leadership. I want to see the community > > > grow, I really want to lead the group , but for the past 1-2 years > > > when the group is getting bigger,I realized that I am holding a > > > different ideology than many people that make my objective for the > > > group is something not relevant. I don't think many people will agree > > > with me. > > > > > > So I think the best way is for me to pass the leadership to others. I > > > am sorry that I am failing some of you here, but when I founded the > > > group, I wasn't dreaming having a big community and make profit from > > > it. I did it because I fell in love of Ubuntu and back then it wasn't > > > as famous as now and people contribute as they like, no commitment and > > > nobody will force anyone to do anything, it's a free community in a > > > free cyber world, but things changed... Nothing is free anymore, the > > > community has adopted a businessman way of thinking. Open Source is no > > > longer something you do for fun in your free time. It has become a > > > business where you need to be fully committed. Well, it's true this > > > way of thinking will give you the chance to profit from it. But, > > > that's against my belief, the open source religion which I once was a > > > devoted follower. Things changed, I don't want to be the barrier to > > > anyone with my narrow mindedness. > > > > > > I am not putting away the principle that I've been upholding, I built > > > the group, no matter how bad/suck I am as a leader, I have achieved > > > what I wanted, to take it from nothing to where It is now, though some > > > might claim that I did nothing. But it's now no longer relevant to > > > me... The group is no longer my group , the group is no longer > > > carrying the same teaching of a religion that I was once a follower. > > > > > > I wish the people who will take over the leadership will take care of > > > the group well, we might have a different ideology, but I will still > > > give my support at least as an ex-follower of the so called free > > > software movement, a religion which is no longer valid to me. I wish > > > you guys all the best, and I would like to apologize for anything bad > > > I have done. I believe you guys will be able to give a new light to > > > the group with your style of leadership and I hope that everyone will > > > learn something from my mistake as a leader. Nicholas, thank you for > > > being with me from day one. I was hoping that you will take over the > > > leadership, but I understand that you have your own commitment. > > > > > > As for the rest of you, thank you for supporting Ubuntu Malaysia and > > > for making it where it is now. > > > > > > > > > p/s: I will send an email out to some of you guys in few days time > > > regarding the leadership of the group. > > > > > > > > > Zarul > > > > > > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 11:22 PM, Donald P Kong <<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a> > > > <mailto:<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a>>> wrote: > > > > > >     there is no shortage of people trying to make money from > > >     open-source... > > > > > >     what are your plans? can you not share them here? or are you here to > > >     scour for ideas and implement them in your own time to your own > > >     benefit? > > > > > >     we have many groups scattered around Malaysia who are actively > > >     promoting > > >     open-source and Ubuntu for free. while monetary returns would be > > >     desirable, it should not be the main driving factor. > > > > > >     nevertheless, i would be happy to listen to your proposals to > > >     encourage > > >     the usage of open-source and Ubuntu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >     On Wed, 2008-06-18 at 16:09 +0800, Pepper Lim wrote: > > >     > I'm not sure if I'm going about this correctly. I couldn't find the > > >     > rules for posting at > > >     <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > > >     > so forgive me if this posting is inappropriate. > > >     > > > >     > I've been thinking of a plan to bring Ubuntu and open source > > >     software to > > >     > Malaysians and Malaysian companies. It comprises of a business plan > > >     > (making money while we have fun kicking Microsoft's butt) and a few > > >     > other ideas. > > >     > > > >     > I would be interested to meet anyone else who would like to > > >     brainstorm > > >     > this idea. Please email me at <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> > > >     <mailto:<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> or call me at > > >     > 012-2951245 > > >     > > > >     > -- > > >     > -- > > >     > Pepper Lim > > >     > 012-2951245 > > >     > <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> > > >     > Pepper's "Lim Family Tree" <a href="http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree</a> > > >     > BBBS Old Boys' Association website <a href="http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba</a> > > >     > > > >     > > > >     -- > > > > > >     -------%%@ > > > > > >     Donald P Kong > > >     +6019-887-7337 > > >     +6016-809-7227 > > > > > >     <a href="http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org" target="_blank">http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org</a> > > >     <a href="http://www.foss-solutions.com" target="_blank">http://www.foss-solutions.com</a> > > >     <a href="http://www.kuchingosc.org" target="_blank">http://www.kuchingosc.org</a> > > > > > > > > >     -- > > >     Ubuntu-my mailing list > > >     <a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a>> > > >     Modify settings or unsubscribe at: > > >     <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > -------%%@ > > Donald P Kong > +6019-887-7337 > +6016-809-7227 > > <a href="http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org" target="_blank">http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org</a> > <a href="http://www.foss-solutions.com" target="_blank">http://www.foss-solutions.com</a> > <a href="http://www.kuchingosc.org" target="_blank">http://www.kuchingosc.org</a> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 19:15:15 +0800 > From: Pepper Lim <<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> > Subject: Re: [ubuntu-my] Ubuntu-my Digest, Vol 18, Issue 4 > To: <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:485A3FC3.5000905@3people.org">485A3FC3.5000905@3people.org</a>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > After reading Zarul's post, I felt very compelled to share my ideas > immediately. I hope you will take some time to read this. > > I'm all for open source software and keeping software free (as in free > beer) forever. But I read an interesting interview with Mark > Shuttleworth where he describes plans to make Canonical profitable in > order to pay the core staff who will work on Ubuntu. When I read that, I > suddenly understood how Ubuntu could be free for you and me. It is free > because Canonical is "paying" for it. You can see a list of commercial > services by Canonical here <a href="http://www.canonical.com/services" target="_blank">http://www.canonical.com/services</a> > > This is similar to the "problem with paying for water" - water is given > by God so it should be free. So why is Syabas charging us for it?! Well, > the answer is simple: Syabas builds the dams to store the water, they > clean the water, they build the pipes to bring water to house etc. In > short, we are paying for their service. I am applying the same concept > to my idea. > > In a nutshell, my plan is to turn a profit as we promote Ubuntu to small > and medium businesses. I see it as a win-win situation. We get some > payment (service fee) to keep a core staff who in turn will provide > support (service) to our customers. Customers on the other hand get free > software (Ubuntu) and terrific service, tech support, software training > etc. from our staff. > > Just a quick glance: it costs about RM2400++ to install Windows XP, MS > Office, Norton AV, Nero 7 and WinZip Pro on 1 (one) PC. 10 PCs in a > medium company will mean RM24,000 on software alone! The cost goes up to > RM6300++ if Photoshop and Illustrator is installed too. I thought, why > not charge a small fraction of that and convince the small and medium > companies to switch to Ubuntu. Many companies are still using pirated > software that are unable to receive software updates. So rather than > risk having BSA come knocking on their doors, we will convert them to > Ubuntu users. > > We will need to overcome the following problems: > >    1. Wrong perception - people view free stuff as lousy, poor support, >       here-today-gone-tomorrow. >    2. Difficult to use - people are usually resistant to change. >    3. BSA won't raid them - judging by the events unfolding in the USA, >       Britain etc. it won't be long before they really do come-a-knocking! > > If all goes well, Malaysia's Ubuntu community can stand proud with the > best Ubuntu communities from around the world. I hope you continue your > struggle with us, brother Zarul. > > > > <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com</a> wrote: > > Send Ubuntu-my mailing list submissions to > >     <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > >     <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > >     <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-request@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > >     <a href="mailto:ubuntu-my-owner@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my-owner@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of Ubuntu-my digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > >    1. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (Tho Man) > >    2. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (Donald P Kong) > >    3. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (zarul shahrin) > >    4. Re:  Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians (Altaf Jauhar) > >    5. Re:  Ubuntu-my Digest, Vol 18, Issue 3 (Pepper Lim) > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:32:53 +0800 > > From: "Tho Man" <<a href="mailto:shuhaimie@gmail.com">shuhaimie@gmail.com</a>> > > Subject: Re: [ubuntu-my] Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians > > To: "Malaysian Team Mailing List" <<a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a>> > > Message-ID: > >     <<a href="mailto:9ce5212a0806180732u184af83dr199cef09a86762df@mail.gmail.com">9ce5212a0806180732u184af83dr199cef09a86762df@mail.gmail.com</a>> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > > this would be nice....i like to join but my time is limited....may be we can > > have a brainstorming online how we can tap a market on this. > > why not start a google group and we can discuss bout this... > > make money is always something good to me..hehehehe... > > > > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 4:09 PM, Pepper Lim <<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> wrote: > > > > > >> I'm not sure if I'm going about this correctly. I couldn't find the > >> rules for posting at <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > >> so forgive me if this posting is inappropriate. > >> > >> I've been thinking of a plan to bring Ubuntu and open source software to > >> Malaysians and Malaysian companies. It comprises of a business plan > >> (making money while we have fun kicking Microsoft's butt) and a few > >> other ideas. > >> > >> I would be interested to meet anyone else who would like to brainstorm > >> this idea. Please email me at <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> or call me at > >> 012-2951245 > >> > >> -- > >> -- > >> Pepper Lim > >> 012-2951245 > >> <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> > >> Pepper's "Lim Family Tree" <a href="http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree</a> > >> BBBS Old Boys' Association website <a href="http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba</a> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Ubuntu-my mailing list > >> <a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > >> Modify settings or unsubscribe at: > >> <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > -- > -- > Pepper Lim > 012-2951245 > <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> > Pepper's "Lim Family Tree" <a href="http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree</a> > BBBS Old Boys' Association website <a href="http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba</a> > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-my/attachments/20080619/bca9e118/attachment-0001.htm" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-my/attachments/20080619/bca9e118/attachment-0001.htm</a> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 00:09:55 +0800 > From: "Nicholas Ng" <<a href="mailto:nbliang@gmail.com">nbliang@gmail.com</a>> > Subject: Re: [ubuntu-my] Bringing Ubuntu and open source to Malaysians > To: "Malaysian Team Mailing List" <<a href="mailto:ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a>> > Message-ID: >       <<a href="mailto:de91f8ba0806190909v221f86c8sca3e9200b3aec016@mail.gmail.com">de91f8ba0806190909v221f86c8sca3e9200b3aec016@mail.gmail.com</a>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Zarul, > > Seems like there are still many members that want you to stay. :-) And > I also believe so that you should stay, although we have talked about > it personally. Other members such as mypapit, sumardi, e-jat, fenris > and the rest of the team are doing a great job in keeping the > community moving (organizing meetups, etc) and we should thanks them > for that. > > The community is started by you and lead by you, and always this is > the way although sometimes we faced difficulties and have different > thinking / way of doing things but we can discussed and applied the > take-and-give approach to settle the issues. I personally hope that > you remain as the lead and the rest of us will keep it moving, > although you may be busy with your work and own commitment. > > Altaf, > > The reason why Ubuntu Malaysia exist is because we want to have a > dedicated local community for Ubuntu. Ubuntu Malaysia can be a subset > of the bigger group but as I mentioned it is mainly for Ubuntu Linux > and not Novell's SUSE or Red Hat or other distro, so it is better to > stay as a single entity but with good collaboration / link to other > communities. > > Pepper Lim, > > Your idea is good where we should generate some income for the > community (and I hope is not for own purpose) so that we can have more > funded activities as well as organizing bigger project such as our own > Malaysia's Ubuntu ShipIt effort. :-P But, I am with Donald and Zarul > where our ideology on FLOSS is not on business side. I do not against > your intention and will be supporting your effort to push the adoption > of Ubuntu to local companies. :-) > > > Cheers, > > Nicholas Ng > > > On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 7:07 PM, Donald P Kong <<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a>> wrote: > > Zarul, > > > > ?it is sad to see you go. hopefully, you will re-consider your > > stand. ?maybe it would help for you to know that not all in this group > > are merely opportunists looking to make a buck out of Linux. i hope that > > would make you remain as the leader. > > > > ubuntu-my is not the only list suffering "commercialisation" issues. as > > i see it, most people join this and any other linux communities to look > > for opportunities and answers. once they get their answer or see no > > money to be made, they move on. few are willing to contribute in helping > > others which is what the FLOSS is all about. in our own local > > activities, it is nearly impossible to get volunteers to show up. > > > > most malaysians see Linux as a big chance to make money since it is in > > demand and as long as potential customers cannot find alternative > > sources of assistance, they're locked into one vendor thereby ensuring > > continued income. > > > > > > Altaf, > > > > ubuntu-my is a community of Ubuntu users and would be targeted > > specifically at ubuntu users. i don't quite understand the suggestion of > > "working under a bigger malaysian user group". i would believe most of > > the members here are also members in other general linux groups as well. > > > > i agree that Linux users should not be "fighting" Microsoft. instead we > > should concentrate on promoting the usage of Linux on desktops. the only > > way that we can effectively do this if we were users ourselves. only > > then can we know the downside of Linux and how to work around it. then > > in time, new users will realise how much better Linux is and then make > > their choice. > > > > personally, i am a Debian user but my mother, wife and children's > > computers/laptops are using Ubuntu. it is a much more "friendlier" and > > "easier" Linux to promote. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, 2008-06-19 at 08:32 +0800, Altaf Jauhar wrote: > >> ubuntu-my should be working under bigger malaysian user groups such as > >> MyPenguin99. Alot of users under the group are ubuntu users... splitting > >> into another group is not good. we need to coperate and team up to > >> create a larger group. devide and we'll fall. combine and we'll grow. > >> > >> ahh... zarul..... you should just continue to be the leader... a person > >> who started it should be the leader... coz you have the real spirit and > >> understand the true meaning of creating the group in the first place. > >> > >> btw, we should not fight 'microsoft' anymore..... it is more like linux > >> and microsoft will co-exist whether we like it or not. microsoft have > >> been doing alot of changes lately... and one of it is to 'accept' linux > >> and oss. that's why if you see projects like mono have not yet been > >> 'banned' from the scene. > >> > >> honestly, i'm not a fulltime ubuntu nerd.. i'm more of a slackware nerd. > >> but, i think ubuntu is cool and is the best thing a non-geek can get his > >> or her hands on - if he/she wants to give linux a try. he'll/she'll be > >> running linux in no time.. and enjoying it. 1 more thing, it must not > >> just be ubuntu. it should be including all its variant: kubuntu, > >> edubuntu, xubuntu.... coz not all ppl will like gnome (i'm a xfce and > >> kde guy myself). > >> > >> ok. thats all for now. > >> > >> regards, > >> he]ix. > >> > >> > >> > >> zarul shahrin wrote: > >> > How sad, I think I am no longer have heart for the community, I am > >> > proud that I founded the group and built it from zero, well, we might > >> > not be as active as the group from other countries but getting this > >> > far is already beyond my expectation. Anyway, this group is getting > >> > bigger I will let people who are more active like  Nicholas, mypapit > >> > and e-jat to take over the leadership. I want to see the community > >> > grow, I really want to lead the group , but for the past 1-2 years > >> > when the group is getting bigger,I realized that I am holding a > >> > different ideology than many people that make my objective for the > >> > group is something not relevant. I don't think many people will agree > >> > with me. > >> > > >> > So I think the best way is for me to pass the leadership to others. I > >> > am sorry that I am failing some of you here, but when I founded the > >> > group, I wasn't dreaming having a big community and make profit from > >> > it. I did it because I fell in love of Ubuntu and back then it wasn't > >> > as famous as now and people contribute as they like, no commitment and > >> > nobody will force anyone to do anything, it's a free community in a > >> > free cyber world, but things changed... Nothing is free anymore, the > >> > community has adopted a businessman way of thinking. Open Source is no > >> > longer something you do for fun in your free time. It has become a > >> > business where you need to be fully committed. Well, it's true this > >> > way of thinking will give you the chance to profit from it. But, > >> > that's against my belief, the open source religion which I once was a > >> > devoted follower. Things changed, I don't want to be the barrier to > >> > anyone with my narrow mindedness. > >> > > >> > I am not putting away the principle that I've been upholding, I built > >> > the group, no matter how bad/suck I am as a leader, I have achieved > >> > what I wanted, to take it from nothing to where It is now, though some > >> > might claim that I did nothing. But it's now no longer relevant to > >> > me... The group is no longer my group , the group is no longer > >> > carrying the same teaching of a religion that I was once a follower. > >> > > >> > I wish the people who will take over the leadership will take care of > >> > the group well, we might have a different ideology, but I will still > >> > give my support at least as an ex-follower of the so called free > >> > software movement, a religion which is no longer valid to me. I wish > >> > you guys all the best, and I would like to apologize for anything bad > >> > I have done. I believe you guys will be able to give a new light to > >> > the group with your style of leadership and I hope that everyone will > >> > learn something from my mistake as a leader. Nicholas, thank you for > >> > being with me from day one. I was hoping that you will take over the > >> > leadership, but I understand that you have your own commitment. > >> > > >> > As for the rest of you, thank you for supporting Ubuntu Malaysia and > >> > for making it where it is now. > >> > > >> > > >> > p/s: I will send an email out to some of you guys in few days time > >> > regarding the leadership of the group. > >> > > >> > > >> > Zarul > >> > > >> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 11:22 PM, Donald P Kong <<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a> > >> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:dpkong@pc.jaring.my">dpkong@pc.jaring.my</a>>> wrote: > >> > > >> >     there is no shortage of people trying to make money from > >> >     open-source... > >> > > >> >     what are your plans? can you not share them here? or are you here to > >> >     scour for ideas and implement them in your own time to your own > >> >     benefit? > >> > > >> >     we have many groups scattered around Malaysia who are actively > >> >     promoting > >> >     open-source and Ubuntu for free. while monetary returns would be > >> >     desirable, it should not be the main driving factor. > >> > > >> >     nevertheless, i would be happy to listen to your proposals to > >> >     encourage > >> >     the usage of open-source and Ubuntu. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> >     On Wed, 2008-06-18 at 16:09 +0800, Pepper Lim wrote: > >> >     > I'm not sure if I'm going about this correctly. I couldn't find the > >> >     > rules for posting at > >> >     <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > >> >     > so forgive me if this posting is inappropriate. > >> >     > > >> >     > I've been thinking of a plan to bring Ubuntu and open source > >> >     software to > >> >     > Malaysians and Malaysian companies. It comprises of a business plan > >> >     > (making money while we have fun kicking Microsoft's butt) and a few > >> >     > other ideas. > >> >     > > >> >     > I would be interested to meet anyone else who would like to > >> >     brainstorm > >> >     > this idea. Please email me at <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> > >> >     <mailto:<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> or call me at > >> >     > 012-2951245 > >> >     > > >> >     > -- > >> >     > -- > >> >     > Pepper Lim > >> >     > 012-2951245 > >> >     > <a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:pepperlim@3people.org">pepperlim@3people.org</a>> > >> >     > Pepper's "Lim Family Tree" <a href="http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/limfamilytree</a> > >> >     > BBBS Old Boys' Association website <a href="http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba" target="_blank">http://www.3people.org/bbbssoba</a> > >> >     > > >> >     > > >> >     -- > >> > > >> >     -------%%@ > >> > > >> >     Donald P Kong > >> >     +6019-887-7337 > >> >     +6016-809-7227 > >> > > >> >     <a href="http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org" target="_blank">http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org</a> > >> >     <a href="http://www.foss-solutions.com" target="_blank">http://www.foss-solutions.com</a> > >> >     <a href="http://www.kuchingosc.org" target="_blank">http://www.kuchingosc.org</a> > >> > > >> > > >> >     -- > >> >     Ubuntu-my mailing list > >> >     <a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a>> > >> >     Modify settings or unsubscribe at: > >> >     <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > > -- > > > > -------%%@ > > > > Donald P Kong > > +6019-887-7337 > > +6016-809-7227 > > > > <a href="http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org" target="_blank">http://nanasbarat.dyndns.org</a> > > <a href="http://www.foss-solutions.com" target="_blank">http://www.foss-solutions.com</a> > > <a href="http://www.kuchingosc.org" target="_blank">http://www.kuchingosc.org</a> > > > > > > -- > > Ubuntu-my mailing list > > <a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> > > Modify settings or unsubscribe at: <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> > > > > ------------------------------ > -- Ubuntu-my mailing list <a href="mailto:Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com">Ubuntu-my@lists.ubuntu.com</a> Modify settings or unsubscribe at: <a href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my" target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-my</a> </blockquote></div>