[ubuntu-in] SCIM: Some Questions in Baraha system

Dinbandhu dinbandhu at sprynet.com
Tue Sep 4 20:17:32 BST 2007

On Mon, 2007-09-03 at 11:53 +0530, Gora Mohanty wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-08-29 at 22:27 -0400, Dinbandhu wrote:
> > Some follow-up questions regarding the baraha and Unicode work:
> [...]
> > I am wondering if you have finished work on the Shiva font yet?
> [...]
> I have one remaining issue in how to handle some special glyphs
> in 8-bit fonts, e.g., ones that combine a matra with a reph, and
> thus require reordering of input characters. I hope to have this
> fixed over the next couple of days, and will in any case make
> something available by Wed., as the work is largely done, and
> ready for testing to commence.

Sounds great.

> > I would also like to consider getting the Baraha TTF Hindi font working
> > in Unicode, and would be willing to get it set up if there is some
> > guideline for how to do it.
> Sure, and your help in getting this working will be most useful.
> The problem is that it will require me to prepare at least a
> minimal write-up, and I am not sure if I can promise to finish
> that even by the middle of next week. Let us see how that goes.

ok. Just let me know when it's ready, and I'll get started.

> > 2. When typing in OO Writer, there is a default font which Writer
> > always starts using whenever typing in Hindi. You had mentioned
> > earlier that it just selects whichever is first in its list. Is there
> > a way to change what will be the default font, to one which
> > I like better?

> [...] 

>   fc-list :lang=hi file
> If the order of fonts shown by the above command is not desirable
> (on Ubuntu, it is probably preferable that something like Lohit
> Hindi or Gargi be the default font), 

What is the reason that is preferable to have Lohit Hindi or Gargi be
the default font?

If in the process of finishing the Shiva font or adding the Baraha font
something comes which is preferable to the current default (Lohit
Hindi), then will there be a problem caused by changing the default to
that font?

> it is possible to change that
> with configuration directives in ~/.fonts.conf (per user), or
> /etc/fonts/local.conf. I have forgotten the details of these,
> but will send them in a separate message, or someone else can
> chip in.

I would really like to be able to change the default. If you or someone
is able to post a set of clear instructions for these configuration
directives, that would be great.

> > 3. When typing in hi-baraha in OO Writer, it seems to have trouble
> > with certain characters in particular settings. For example:
> > 
> > A) If one types the specific combination: "मैं (that is, मैं after a
> > quote mark) then the ( ं ) will not type, and it happens every time.
> > This ( ं ) will type in any other character after the ("), but not in
> > the specific word: मैं . And मैं otherwise almost always types fine in
> > OO Writer so long as not preceded by (").
> > 
> >   B) When one types [तुम जाओ], then by typing the final "]",
> > the ओ just prior to it gets deleted. This happens less if the opening
> > "[" is not present, and does not seem to be a problem with most other
> > characters. However, it also happens with ए. if an ए is typed just
> > before a final "]", then there too, the ए  is deleted. 
> > 
> > None of the above happens in my e-mail software, Evolution. But it
> > happens in Open Office. 
> Will check it out. I am in the middle of a dist-upgrade, and
> cannot check Open Office or SCIM at the moment. 

ok. Please let me know. --thanks.

> Could you tell us
> which version of Open Office you are using, i.e., what output do
> you get on typing
>   dpkg -l openoffice.org
> in a terminal. 

swarup at swarup-laptop:~$ dpkg -l openoffice.org
|/ Err?=(none)/Hold/Reinst-required/X=both-problems (Status,Err:
||/ Name           Version        Description
ii  openoffice.org 2.2.0-1ubuntu4 OpenOffice.org Office suite

Above is the terminal output in response to the command you gave.

When I open OO, the splash opening insignia appears with openoffice.org
2.2. And when OO is open, under "About OO" it says "Openoffice 2.2.0".

> > 4. Some Hindi fonts switch to Times Roman or Arial font whenever
> > punctuation is typed such as ,.|?!"'[]{} etc. When that happens, the
> > Times Roman/Arial character sometimes doesn't match at all in size
> > with the Hindi font. Is there a way to avert this problem?
> This happens because the Hindi font that you are using does not
> include glyphs for Latin letters (including punctuation), so that
> the application is getting these from some other font, which is
> why the glyph sizes are mismatched. The best way to fix this is
> to ask the font designer to include Latin characters from a
> suitable free font in the Hindi font. As this is quite a common
> problem, the designer ought to be willing to do that.

I see. Do some of the Unicode Hindi fonts included glyphs for Latin
letters? And is there a list of them? Or if not, could you mention a few
you know which do include glyphs for Latin letters? Up till now, I have
found all the Unicode Hindi fonts I have tried to be problematic for
this reason, amongst others. 

(Another problem, perhaps also related with the Latin character issue,
is the way most of these Unicode Hindi fonts deal with quotation marks.
Lohit Hindi, for example, puts one style of mark at the beginning of a
quotation, and a totally different style of mark at the end to close the
quote. Another font I tried and otherwise liked better than Lohit Hindi
in style, Kalimati, has no quotation marks. [Instead of an opening
quotation mark, some bizarre full height thick double bar appears.])

I could try and find the fond designer of whatever font I end up
settling with and ask them to include Latin characters. But perhaps
easiest is just to go with something which already has the Latin
characters included. 


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