Re: [Bug 523236] Re: Translation problem in Nautilus (French version):21ère

JF jf at
Lun 22 Fév 19:58:59 UTC 2010

> @JF
> Thank you for your input. I do agree that the translation is not the best
> representation of what this bug is describing, which is why I left your
> initial description untouched. The translation is simply a means for
> developers and other bug triagers who may encounter similar reports to
> have an idea of what is going on, even if they do not speak French.
> I especially felt this may be necessary since a member of the Ubuntu
> French Translators team has determined that this is not a translation
> issue on their end.

I’m a little surprised because they could very easily fix the problem (at
least for French).
I’m aware there are other languages whose ordinal numbers behave in a more
complicated way than in English. Therefore a more general solution to that
problem should be found in Nautilus itself. But for French
 see below:
— 1st: premier / première (*)
— 11th: onzième
— 21st: vingt-et-unième
— 31st: trente-et-unième
— 41st: quarante-et-unième
— 51st: cinquante-et-unième
— 61st: soixante-et-unième
— 71st: septante-et-unième / soixante-et-onzième (**)
— 81st: huitante-et-unième / quatre-vingt-unième / octante-et-unième (***)
— 91st: nonante-et-unième / quatre-vingt-onzième (**)
— 101st: cent-unième
(*) The first form is used for the masculine, the second one, for the
(**) The first form is used in Belgium and Switzerland, the second one, in
France and Quebec.
(***) The first form is used in Switzerland, the second one, in Belgium,
France and Quebec, the third one is almost dead.

As you can see, where English uses first, French has three forms: premier
(-ère), unième and onzième.
Premier (-ère) is used only for the very first one, the one where English
simply uses the word “copy”. The translation “ère copie” for “st copy” is
then useless. In ALL other places where English uses “st copy”, French
always uses words with the suffix “-ième”.
So, if “st copy” was translated “e copie”, the problem would be solved for

> If I understand Alexandre correctly, then the issue
> is in the programming of Nautilus. It seems that Nautilus is setup to
> use -st, -nd, and -th after certain numbers. When translated, the -st,
> -nd, and -th endings are replaced by their counterparts in the set
> language. However, the settings for which ending goes with which numbers
> remains the same as in English. This results in the behavior that you
> have described.

That’s what I understood, but I still pretend that the French translation
team could, at least temporarily, solve the problem: if they translated
“st copy” by “e copie” instead of “ère copie”, the problem would instantly
be solved for French.

> Since this is an issue with the programming of Nautilus, the bug has
> been filed upstream for the GNOME developers to look at. Along with the
> description that Alexandre provided in English on the upstream report, I
> thought it may help for the developers to be able to read an English
> translation of your description. While the translation is not perfect,
> it may help clarify the points that Alexandre made.
> Thank you again for filing this report, and please continue to let us
> know of any problems you encounter so we can work to make Ubuntu better!

I did notice three other problems.
The first one is about the braille keyboard which is no more available in
Karmic (Gnome).
The second one is about the command setxkbmap which causes problems in
relation with Gnome’s keyboard layout manager.
The third one is about xim and the OLPC Amharic xkb keyboard and Compose
file which are a little messy in a multilingual environment. (It uses
Latin letters as dead keys.)

I don’t know where I could report those problems. Can you help me?

> --
> Translation problem in Nautilus (French version): 21ère
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
> Status in Nautilus: Unknown
> Status in Ubuntu Translations (internationalization and localization):
> Invalid
> Status in ?nautilus? package in Ubuntu: Triaged
> Bug description:
> Binary package hint: nautilus
> Bonjour.
> J?ai noté un petit problème avec la version française de Gnome.
> Je crée un nouveau répertoire : il s?appelle « nouveau dossier ».
> J?en fais une copie en appuyant sur Ctrl et en faisant glisser l?icône du
> répertoire : la copie s?appelle « nouveau dossier (copie) ».
> J?en fais encore une copie : elle s?appelle « nouveau dossier (autre
> copie) ».
> J?en fais encore une copie : elle s?appelle « nouveau dossier (3e
> copie) ».
> Je continue ainsi jusqu?à « nouveau dossier (20e copie) ».
> J?en fais une nouvelle copie et, là, ça devient intéressant : elle
> s?appelle « nouveau dossier (21ère copie) ».
> 21ÈRE !!!
> J?ai fait quelques centaines de copies, chaque fois que le numéro se
> termine par 11, je vois « 11e » (en anglais : elevenTH ? 11th), alors que,
> quand le numéro se termine par 1 mais pas par 11, je vois « 1ère » (en
> anglais : first ? 1st).
> Il s?agit clairement d?un problème de traduction, l?anglais utilisant
> « first » là où le français utilise « unième ».
> Comme les deux premières copies s?appellent « copie » et « autre copie »,
> on pourrait très bien mettre le suffixe « e » à tous les numéros.
> Configuration : Nautilus 2.28.1 sous Ubuntu 9.10
> ProblemType: Bug
> Architecture: i386
> Date: Wed Feb 17 15:57:28 2010
> DistroRelease: Ubuntu 9.10
> ExecutablePath: /usr/bin/nautilus
> InstallationMedia: Ubuntu 9.10 "Karmic Koala" - Release i386 (20091028.5)
> Package: nautilus 1:2.28.1-0ubuntu3
> ProcEnviron:
>  LANG=fr_BE.UTF-8
>  SHELL=/bin/bash
> ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 2.6.31-19.56-generic
> SourcePackage: nautilus
> Uname: Linux 2.6.31-19-generic i686
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Translation problem in Nautilus (French version): 21ère
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