[Ubuntu-eg] Stallman says cloud computing is a trap
Seif Lotfy
seif at lotfy.com
Mon Jun 10 12:16:38 UTC 2013
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:42 PM, Amr Ali <amr.ali.cc at gmail.com> wrote:
> This is not popular, but TOR is not as secure as "people" like to proclaim.
> Browser plugins can completely circumvent the intended security of
> communicating
> over TOR by establishing direct connections, node-poisoning (i.e.,
> introducing
> several "Eve" nodes in the network) to mount traffic analysis and find
> correlations at the exit and entry nodes to identify the origin of the
> connection or the nature of the content.
>
> And in fact any distributed communication setup is vulnerable to these
> types of
> attacks. The difference between using something like TOR and not using it
> is
> basically raising the bar to face more skilled adversaries.
>
> The point is, you can surely try to make it harder, but it's futile if you
> become a subject of interest to a well funded and well organized adversary.
>
> That of course and you'll have to suffer a high degradation of QoS due to
> the
> security requirements of these types of distributed setups. There's a good
> solution on the rise (i.e., Homomorphic Cryptography) that would store
> your data
> in the cloud in encrypted form and you can run processes against it without
> exposing the data to the service provider, but that still has some work to
> be
> done to go mainstream.
>
Nice... :D
>
> On 06/10/2013 01:26 PM, AMahdy AbdElAziz wrote:
> > Correct me if I'm wrong but AFAK, Tor is hiding your traces from the
> Website not
> > from the ISP. Your ISP is the final line sending you the "data" and knows
> > exactly from where this data is coming.
> >
> > --
> > AMahdy AbdElAziz
> > http://www.AMahdy.net
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Mohammed Gamal <m.gamal005 at gmail.com
> > <mailto:m.gamal005 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > @Amahdy:
> > You can still use something like Tor if you want to hide your traffic
> > from your ISP. The problem with cloud sites is that YOUR data resides
> > at THEIR servers, so you have absolutely no control over it, and this
> > is a valid risk (whether you're willing to take it is a different
> > story). Stallman might be overdoing it, but he has some valid
> > arguments.
> >
> > That's why initiatives like decentralized social networks like
> > Freedombox and Diaspora are important to provide a future alternative
> > for centralized social networks and clouds like Google and Facebook.
> >
> > I recommend you watch two talk by Eben Moglen, one titled 'Freedom in
> > the cloud' and 'Why Political Liberty Depends on Software Freedom
> More
> > Than Ever' keynote speech at FOSDEM 2011. Search for them in youtube,
> > they're very informative.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Mohammed
> >
> > On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 1:08 PM, AMahdy AbdElAziz <amahdy7 at gmail.com
> > <mailto:amahdy7 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > > +1 for Amr Ali. I kept repeating this for ever, it's your choice
> to either
> > > stay outdated and ages behind technology just seeking a way for a
> fake
> > > "privacy" and "free software", or to just move on like everybody
> on planet
> > > earth is peacefully with his life. What's the big issue if someone
> in USA
> > > knows your current location right "now"? What if they just hired a
> physical
> > > person to track your current location, would you be able to stop
> him?
> > >
> > > Just place a big bold line between your internet life and your
> real life and
> > > that's it.
> > >
> > > GNU Linux is "free open source software" but you never know what
> the
> > > executable that you download pre-built contains. Will you download
> the
> > > source of everything and compile? then make sure to "read" the
> source code
> > > of everything too AND tell me how you gonna compile a compiler
> from source.
> > >
> > > Right now even if you open the internet from a direct connection
> with no
> > > proxies, how can you tell that whoever providing you internet
> (your ISP) is
> > > not tracking you? They easily CAN do it, and if it's not them then
> whoever
> > > provide your ISP internet CAN do it. Big hassle to worry about it
> and at the
> > > end of the day, do you really have something on internet to hide
> it? Please
> > > just hide it now and forever!
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > AMahdy AbdElAziz
> > > http://www.AMahdy.net
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 12:52 PM, Amr Ali <amr.ali.cc at gmail.com
> > <mailto:amr.ali.cc at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> The problem is not privacy, what is privacy? It's BS, doesn't
> exist. If
> > >> someone
> > >> wants privacy they should simply stop using the Internet, find a
> cave and
> > >> protect it against satellite thermal imaging, and stay there for
> good.
> > >> Also it
> > >> is not about interfaces, Stallman is simply being stupid and
> ignorant by
> > >> suggesting that having your own mail-server or replicating any of
> today's
> > >> infrastructure technologies will help you in any significant way;
> > >> absolutely
> > >> not! It's about Big Data and information dissemination.
> > >>
> > >> There are just a few reasons that most "people" really need
> privacy for
> > >> and they
> > >> are mostly unjustified and often ludicrous. There's no way you
> can assert
> > >> the
> > >> privacy of a piece of information once it goes outside your
> machine;
> > >> granted
> > >> there are methods to help you "feel" more secure, but truth of
> the matter
> > >> is,
> > >> security in itself is a "feeling", it is an illusion, it's
> confidence
> > >> built upon
> > >> the unlikelihood of a persistent adversary, and that's why we
> invented the
> > >> nomenclature of Advanced Persistent Threat (APT) which is used to
> account
> > >> for
> > >> worst case scenario profiles of malware, individuals, and
> organizations.
> > >> Nothing
> > >> can be secure or private indefinitely, it is theoretically
> impossible due
> > >> to the
> > >> lack of an epistemological authoritative root that can assert the
> security
> > >> or
> > >> privacy of any piece of information (e.g., Certificate
> Authorities are
> > >> pseudo-roots because who can be authoritative about their
> security? No
> > >> one!)
> > >>
> > >> I've helped build services that you just won't believe how
> accurately it
> > >> can
> > >> pin-point your location and identify you out of millions of other
> users
> > >> based on
> > >> very small data facets it collects once you visit any site that
> uses the
> > >> service
> > >> (and you cannot do much about it btw unless you want to start
> using Lynx),
> > >> it
> > >> sits on-top of billions of fingerprints. It is simply
> preposterous to even
> > >> think
> > >> that you have significant control over anything that comes out of
> your
> > >> computer.
> > >>
> > >> </rant>
> > >>
> > >> National security under today's challenges (i.e., the fact that
> the
> > >> virtual can
> > >> and does affect the physical) forces governments to tap into the
> most
> > >> fertile
> > >> pool of intelligence.. I've gone on and on about this on my blog
> > >>
> > >>
> > (
> http://d4de.tumblr.com/post/52374664591/thoughts-on-big-data-and-information-dissemination
> ).
> > >>
> > >> On 06/09/2013 10:13 PM, Eslam Mostafa wrote:
> > >> > Hey guys,
> > >> > while reading this article:
> > >> >
> > >> >
> >
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/sep/29/cloud.computing.richard.stallman
> > >> >
> > >> > i was offended by this "The concept of using web-based programs
> like
> > >> > Google's
> > >> > Gmail is "worse than stupidity", according to a leading
> advocate of free
> > >> > software." yeah felt stupid for a moment :D what does the guy
> use ?
> > >> >
> > >> > "this mail has been sent using GMAIL"
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Eslam Mostafa,
> > >> > My Blog <http://cseslam.wordpress.com>
> > >> > My Website <http://eslammostafa.com>
> > >> > GNOME Memeber
> > >> > Python/js/GTK+ Developer
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Amr Ali
> > >>
> > >> --
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> > >
> > >
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> >
>
> --
> Amr Ali
>
> --
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> Ubuntu-eg at lists.ubuntu.com
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