Documentation Rifts and Rebuttals

Thu Jan 14 08:58:25 UTC 2010

David,

I sent that email to you only - it wasn't meant to go to the mailing list,
but it's done now. I'd just like to point out some errors in your email that
if I leave un-corrected might further the confusion that's already
omnipresent in this discussion :)

*"official documentation authors"*
*
*
*There we go with the official stuff again - there is no such thing as
"official" in Ubuntu! As far as I'm aware, none of the docs team are paid by
Canonical for what they do, neither am I or any of our team.
*

*"What did you think was going to happen when you show up to the Doc-Team
and announce your are going to try and out do their efforts with yet another
project?"*

Wrong. We aren't trying to "out-do" their efforts, we are complimenting
them. We're aimed at a different user base than the docs team. I highly
suggest you read our wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual

*"And to try and use their list as a recruiting effort for that goal..."*

Wrong. If you look back at the first email I sent, you'll see that I was
offering collaboration between our project and the main docs - a share of
content and contributors. While we do have a different target audience to
the docs team, some of our content and material will definitely cross over -
and so do our authors. I was extending an invitation to the docs team to use
our resources, not trying to recruit helpers - I don't know where you got
that from.

*"It seems that you are asking for your way and your way only."*

Definitely wrong - if you look back at the original email again you'll
notice that my emphasis was on asking the docs team what they would like
from us, not me demanding what I would like from them! I believe I said
this: "I'd like to ask what else the docs team would like from the manual
team."

I think that a lot of this has actually spiraled out of control and away
from the original email that I sent which was completely different to what
we are now talking about!

Please, everyone go and read my original email to avoid further confusion -
and have a look at our wiki! Especially the FAQ :)

Please, I'm not trying to make enemies! I started off my first email with an
apology because I had worded our justification on the wiki in a way that
cast a bad light on the docs team, and I have corrected this long ago. I'm
asking for collaboration, not approval and I'm not trying to recruit people
for this "evil manual project that plans to take over the docs team work!"

I'm not a silly person, If I honestly thought that what we are trying to
achieve is exactly the same as the docs team then why would I bother pouring
hours and hours of time and effort into this project?

Cheerio, and best of luck for 2010,
Benjamin

On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 8:58 PM, David Wonderly •Darkwing Duck• <
ubuntu at darkwingduck.org> wrote:

> Ben, maybe one of the reasons there are not as many official documentation
> authors is because people are looking to other projects instead of putting
> all things into one place. If its for personal glory or, other reasons I
> don't know. However, having the information in one place is better then
> multiple places in my opinion.
>
> While I understand your frustrations I feel that you brought it on
> yourself. What did you think was going to happen when you show up to the
> Doc-Team and announce your are going to try and out do their efforts with
> yet another project? And to try and use their list as a recruiting effort
> for that goal... Do you know how frustrating that is?
>
> As for the biggest project claim? I don't know if the manual is going to be
> shipped with the operating system, I doubt it with an attitude like that. It
> doesn't seem very... Dare I say, Ubuntu of you does it?
>
> I am sorry that there doesn't seem to be a common ground that we can work
> on as the doc team and your team. It seems that you are asking for your way
> and your way only.
>
> A tip for the future, if you are looking for help there are better ways to
> ask then informing the people you are asking for help from that they are
> failing. Not a good way to start that relationship.
>
> David Wonderly
> ------------------------------
> *From: * Benjamin Humphrey <humphreybc at gmail.com>
> *Date: *Thu, 14 Jan 2010 20:46:17 +1300
> *To: *<ubuntu at darkwingduck.org>
> *Subject: *Re: Documentation Rifts and Rebuttals
>
> Duly noted, thankyou.
>
> We already do have a mailing list - this discussion was just extending on
> from my original email offer to the docs team.
>
> You can imagine how frustrating it can be when our team has worked
> incredibly hard for the last 4 weeks to create something from scratch, and
> then to be told by only one party (the docs team) that it's a waste of time
> and that they're not interested.
>
> If I was in the docs team I would have jumped at the opportunity to
> collaborate with one of the biggest Ubuntu projects on at the moment -
> especially considering the amount of media attention and contributors we
> have. But, obviously they feel different - perhaps this is why they are
> still struggling to find contributors to keep the documentation up to date,
> they might not be open enough to collaboration from other projects. Either
> way, that's not my problem, it's theirs.
>
> I'll stop posting to the docs team mailing list because they are clearly
> not interested in the Manual project.
>
> Cheers
>
> On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 8:41 PM, David Wonderly •Darkwing Duck• <
> ubuntu at darkwingduck.org> wrote:
>
>> Ben,
>>
>> First I would like to kindly ask you to calm down a bit. Nothing to get
>> upset over. You are right, no one can stop you. And you are right about that
>> it is a project. However, this is the Documentation Mailing list and not the
>> Ubuntu Manual Mailing list. So as for your comments on that you have made it
>> clear that it has nothing to do with the list that you are discussing it in.
>>
>> I'm not going to get into a heated argument about the validity of the
>> project. But, since you have made it clear you don't care about what the
>> list has to say about a project that you have said has nothing to do with
>> the mailing list I would suggest that you save yourself some stress and
>> maybe setup a list for your project. Launchpad.net is very good about that.
>>
>> David Wonderly
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Benjamin Humphrey <humphreybc at gmail.com>
>> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2010 20:31:12
>> To: Thomas R. Jones<thomas.jones at maitreyasecurity.com>
>> Cc: Ubuntu Docs<ubuntu-doc at lists.ubuntu.com>
>> Subject: Re: Documentation Rifts and Rebuttals
>>
>> --
>> ubuntu-doc mailing list
>> ubuntu-doc at lists.ubuntu.com
>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Benjamin Humphrey
>
> Ubuntu Manual Project Leader
> Dunedin, New Zealand
>
> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual
> www.interesting.co.nz
> www.benjaminhumphreyphotography.com
>
>

-- 
Benjamin Humphrey

Ubuntu Manual Project Leader
Dunedin, New Zealand

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual
www.interesting.co.nz
www.benjaminhumphreyphotography.com
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