[magnus@therning.org: Python distutils without python-dev?]

[Magnus Therning]

On Sun, Jul 17, 2005 at 08:24:20PM +0100, Ewan Mac Mahon wrote:
>On Sun, Jul 17, 2005 at 12:59:26AM -0400, Tres Seaver wrote:
>>Travis Watkins wrote:
>>>On 7/16/05, Magnus Therning <magnus at therning.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>>>Then Aunt Tilly needs to find out what package contains this
>>>>makefile and install it.
>>>>
>>>>Is this a bug or not?
>>> 
>>>If 'Aunt Tilly' needs to use distutils we've already failed.
>> 
>>So you are planning that every possible Python module in the world is
>>going to be in 'main'? 
>Why do you pick out 'main'? They can be installed with apt just as
>easily from universe.
>
>>distutils is not just a "developer tool", it is the standard
>>"installer" for Python packages.  
>Except that like most non-distro installers it completely fails to work
>with the system's package manager (I don't think that's a flaw in
>distutils, it's just out of its scope). Novice users really don't want
>to break the packaging system this way, any anyone informed enough to
>cope with that sort of hassle is more than informed enough to install
>the python-dev package.
>
>>Phillip Eby's "EasyInstaller" stuff (PEP 330?), won't be able to do
>>its thing without having complete distutils support in place, for
>>instance.
>> 
>IMHO the place for using distutils and things like it is in the package
>build scripts; just like any other sort of build system, and it's fair
>to say that packagers will likely already have the -dev stuff.

So, in short, it's OK to install, by default, a Python package that
contains a module, distutils, that's useless?

Why not break out distutils and put it in python-dev? Exactly the same
arguments listed above can be used to justify it, with the additions:

 - python2.4 would be slightly smaller
 - python2.4 woldn't contain a module that can't be used
 - the doc package wouldn't need the umpteen distutils links

This might not be the most pressing issue, but if Ubuntu is going to
rule the world then it needs to be "expert friendly" as well as "newbie
friendly". If this is a call that should be made in Debian instead then
I'll be more than happy to raise a bug on the Debian package.

/M

-- 
Magnus Therning                    (OpenPGP: 0xAB4DFBA4)
magnus at therning.org
http://therning.org/magnus

Software is not manufactured, it is something you write and publish.
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