Some incisive comments about Linux and KDE 4

[Chan Chung Hang Christopher]

Liam Proven wrote:
> On 2 July 2010 14:59, Chan Chung Hang Christopher
> <christopher.chan at bradbury.edu.hk> wrote:
>> Liam Proven wrote:
>>> On 1 July 2010 15:41, Chan Chung Hang Christopher
>>> <christopher.chan at bradbury.edu.hk> wrote:
>>>> Liam Proven wrote:
>>>>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/06/30/linux_chronicles_part_one/print.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Especially see this linked comment on KDE 4, about which I could
>>>>> hardly agree more:
>>>>> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1079583&cid=26318873
>>>>>
>>>> I run Kubuntu. From Intrepid to Jaunty (still on Jaunty) and it did not
>>>> particularly get in the way even with 4.1. But regardless, without
>>>> kiosktool, it has hit the same worthless level as GNOME. As a personal
>>>> desktop, I'll be willing to use it but that is all. So much for the
>>>> Linux Desktop.
>>> That's fine, for you. You may desperately need this tool that I've
>>> never even heard of, but I've never used it in any of my (small-scale)
>>> live Linux desktop and server rollouts nor have I missed it.
>> Please, did you notice my domain? Likewise, Ubuntu's main target market
>> is where again? Desktops, not servers. Like you, I could care less about
>> kiosktool for servers unless the server is hosting the policies for
>> desktops.
>>
>>
>>> What is a must-have essential for you is someone else's bizarre
>>> unwanted cruft. It's important to realise this.
>>>
>> That someone else's bizarre unwanted cruft is very much in demand in the
>> corporate world. People out there have time only to IMPLEMENT desktop
>> solutions, not ENGINEER desktop solutions. That's why they go Microsoft
>> desktops despite the inherent risks. When the tools allow you to
>> separate user data from the operating system installation, to
>> automatically reinstall a desktop with hours including all its software
>> and security/desktop policies, they start to think less of the security
>> holes that are sufficiently mitigated by anti-malware solutions that
>> come complete with instant notification. Guess what I use my Linux
>> server to do? Automatic installation of Windows on school laptops. If
>> Samba4 were out and ready, then I'd even dispense with the Microsoft
>> servers if I can but I'd still be stuck with Microsoft desktops. Back to
>> admins of corporate desktops.
>>
>> They worry about creating and setting the policies and then getting them
>> applied, not how to build a system to get all accounts personnel to have
>> the same departmental desktop when they log in on the computer and
>> likewise for all staff of other departments.
>>
>> Linux will continue to be the playground of devs for sometime. Just like
>> what they did with KDE. Community? Ha! It's community and 'community'.
> 
> This all may be the case; I'm not arguing it.
> 
> But - and you won't like this, but tough - after being a committed KDE
> fan and promoter in v1 and v2, I felt v3 was too full of cruft and too
> plain-old ugly to recommend and I feel that KDE 4 is dramatically
> worse.

:-D. KDE 3 is not as good looking as the current GNOME is, I will give 
you that. At least, the way the Kubuntu team implemented it on Hardy. 
KDE on RHEL 5 does not look bad at all.


> 
> If it came to a rollout of Linux desktops, I would be happy to
> recommend GNOME. I would not be willing to recommend KDE. So it really
> does not matter how good the deployment tools may be for KDE, because
> I'd not be willing to deploy it.

/me waits till Liam gets to manage hundreds of GNOME desktops, hundreds 
of users spread over more than a dozen groups, with desktop requirements 
based on group membership, some common, others unique to groups.


> 
> Frankly, it seems to me these days that KDE is dying. All the leading
> distros and apps have abandoned it, usually for GNOME and Gtk. Qt
> might survive but it if does it will probably be on mobiles and the
> like, where its owners are strongest and most interested.

There was that call for help...looks like devs have left in droves. 
After all, GNOME has corporate support.


> 
> It used to be the leading Unix desktop, but it is rapidly on its way
> to being an also-ran now, AFAICS. Its developers brought this on
> themselves by trying to include every conceivable feature, make every
> trivial option tweakable and adjustable, while giving insufficient
> consideration to simplicity, ease and good looks. Then once it had
> grown into a bloated monster, they killed it - and wrote a whole new
> bloated monster to replace it.
> 

No contest that this last paragraph, no sir. All that talk about KDE 4.x 
being leaner than KDE 3.5 was pure vapour talk.

In the end, it is just pick your poison. If I am going to get a desktop 
alternative to Microsoft, it's going to be Mac OS X I guess. Kino, K3B 
just ain't worth running KDE 4 for.