[OT] command of English by non-native speakers

[Chris Rees]

2009/12/11 Chan Chung Hang Christopher <christopher.chan at bradbury.edu.hk>:
> Chris Rees wrote:
>> 2009/12/10 Christopher Chan <christopher.chan at bradbury.edu.hk>:
>>
>>> Chris Rees wrote:
>>>
>>>> 2009/12/9 Ian L. Target <ian69 at comcast.net>:
>>>>
>>>>> <snipped>
>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know what the situation is on your side of the Atlantic, but
>>>>>> here in the UK the focus is now mostly on skills for learning,
>>>>>> enjoyment of learning and effective learning. I don't think the
>>>>>> old-fashioned methods for teaching made people enjoy learning, they
>>>>>> were just beaten and bullied into reciting facts and figures.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The modern world is moving at such a pace that although older
>>>>>> generations could leave school knowing most things needed, today the
>>>>>> opposite is true. We can't afford to teach knowledge, because in ten
>>>>>> years' time a huge portion of it will become irrelevant.
>>>>>>
>>>>> I could be wrong, but I do not predict that basic spelling and grammar
>>>>> skills and knowledge of simple mathematics will be obsolete in ten years.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> That's why I said a large amount of KNOWLEDGE will become irrelevant.
>>>> Spelling and grammar SKILLS and simple mathematical SKILLS are what
>>>> gets taught!
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Where? Where? We have way longer school hours and zero grammar being
>>> taught as far as I can tell. Even spelling is a bit of a joke with spell
>>> checkers being available on computers.
>>>
>>
>> As far as you can tell? What does that mean?
>>
>
> Reports from last year about uni's from the UK, Australia and the States
> harping about the grammar of their students and plainly blaming it on
> the lack of grammar drilling er teaching in school. Grammar is now cut
> out of Hong Kong's English language teaching policy. Perhaps the last
> bastion of English grammar in schools are countries like India and the
> Philippines and elsewhere on the African continent. Okay, you still have
> it for foreign students in the UK etc. But I certainly do not hear about
> it being taught to native speakers in places like the UK, Australia and
> the States.
>


Heh, the universities always complain. The changes and improvements
were (AFAICR) implemented in the UK in 1999 (shortly after the
Conservatives were given the boot), and the affected young people are
not at university yet; evidently it takes a while for progress to
show! We'll know fairly soon.

The main problem I have is the general acceptance of shocking
grammatical errors in publications, newspapers etc. Governmental ones
tend to be proofread, but we don't have the equivalent organisation
for ensuring that publications are correct to correspond with
l'académie française, for example.

It's just not difficult to follow rules. What happened to journalistic pride??

Chris

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