[OT] command of English by non-native speakers

[Amedee Van Gasse (ub)]

On Wed, December 9, 2009 19:08, Wendy Galovich wrote:
> On Wed, 9 Dec 2009 11:02:12 -0600
> "Cybe R. Wizard" wrote:
>> Then what will our Creationists have to say?
>>
>> (and is it just another of my own limited perceptions or do most of
>> the Creationists live here in the US?)
>>
>> Cybe R. Wizard
>
> Now that's piqued my curiosity as well.  Here in the US there have been
> a number of lawsuits over teaching of evolution in public schools and
> whether creationism or 'intelligent design' as it has been retooled,
> can or should be taught alongside it.  I don't doubt there are a wide
> range of beliefs in most cultures, but are there actually court battles
> over it, outside the US?

The USA is a special case: you people go to court for the everything. For
us outsiders it looks like money-grabbing lawyers have perverted your
otherwise rather good (in theory) legal system.

I don't know about court battles in Belgium.

The debate is a bit more alive with our friends up north in the
Netherlands, after one member of cabinet (from a christian-conservative
party) publicly asked if creationism should be taught in school along with
evolutionism. But then again the Dutch have always been considered the
Americans of Europe. I suppose that you as an American know where the word
Yankee comes from.
The Netherlands also have a very strong Bible Belt, just like in the USA.
The south of the Netherlands is catholic, just like neighbouring Flanders
(Belgium), and the middle & north are protestant. Some towns are really
hardline protestant and can almost be compared to your Amish.

There is another dimension about the creationism debate, that you probably
don't have in the USA. You may or may not know this, but Europe had a
large immigration of workers from the south of Europe and from Islamic
countries (mostly Morocco and Turkey; France has a large Algerian
community because of their colonial past) until the late 70', and they
brought their families over. In Belgium about 1.13% of the population is
of Moroccan or Turkish origin, and that's not counting third or fourth
generation who automatically have Belgian nationality. How many muslims
live in your city? 1 in 100? Probably a lot less, except perhaps in some
cities on the east coast.
The majority of European muslims is quite moderate, but a very small
minority is very outspoken. It's mostly the same people that can be heard
in the scarf controversy in France and Belgium. It is ironic that the
debate lives in France, the country of "la laicité", but acually it is
French rationalism applied to Islam. Behind the scarfs these people are
usually very modern and nothing like the wahabist fundamentalist.

Most European countries have a scizofrenic attitude towards islamic
creationism. On the one hand, they are against it, but on the other hand,
if you say that, you are considered a racist. The public debate is still
going on. Don't think that there will be a conclusion soon, this is a part
of the transition to a modern, European version of Islam.

-- 
Amedee