Sec=Unclassified RE: Yet another unofficial Ubuntu guide

[Stoffers, Robert LAC]

Ah, the joys of pumping out a very quick email whist at work..

- Robert Stoffers

rob1 @ ubuntu.com

-----Original Message-----
From: sounder-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com
[mailto:sounder-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com]On Behalf Of Stoffers, Robert
LAC
Sent: Monday, 6 February 2006 11:35
To: sounder at lists.ubuntu.com
Subject: Sec=Unclassified RE: Yet another unofficial Ubuntu guide


I think the solution to the problem is simple: the Ubuntu web site as a whole needs a face lift to be clearer and better organised then it currently is. I'm not surprised that new users cannot find the documentation they are after, wiki or official docs, because I myself get lost when looking for them on the web site and I wrote many of them! 

There is a lot of useless garbage on the Ubuntu web site also, multiple FAQs, documentation pages and more. Most of this should just be culled IMO. As for the Tabs at the top of the page, the Wiki tab need to be removed. In its place should be "Documentation" which is just a link to http://help.ubuntu.com, and there should just be a link to the wiki from this page instead. 

The Support page needs to be also be updated, it should directly list places that the user can receive support such as the forums, IRC channels and paid support options. Links to Malone and security information and any other related information should be placed at the bottom of this page, separated from the above. At the moment may of these options require at least another click to find.

The above suggestions are only trivial to implement, but I think will greatly improve how users and google's bots navigate and index the web site.

- Robert Stoffers

rob1 @ ubuntu.com



-----Original Message-----
From: sounder-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com
[mailto:sounder-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com]On Behalf Of Dennis Kaarsemaker
Sent: Monday, 6 February 2006 06:54
To: sounder at lists.ubuntu.com
Subject: Re: Yet another unofficial Ubuntu guide


On zo, 2006-02-05 at 12:14 -0500, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> <quote who="Dennis Kaarsemaker" date="Fri, Feb 03, 2006 at 01:20:25PM
> +0100">
> > On vr, 2006-02-03 at 18:56 +0700, Ananda Putra wrote:
> > > http://easylinux.info/wiki/Ubuntu
> > >
> > > Very nice. Only in single page, simple.
> > > This guide based on Ubuntu 5.10.
> >
> > Why do people keep doing this?!?! The documentation team needs help
> > and
> > yet people are only doing things by themselves. That is SO not
> > helpful...
> 
> Be careful. Ananda, at the very least, *did* find this helfpul. I
> suspect other people did as well.

You're right, with 'not helpful' I don't neccessarily mean 'not helpful
to users', but 'not helpful to {the docteam,Ubuntu,people who read only
the standard documentation}'.

> There are lots of reasons why people will choose not to work within a
> project. Sometimes these reasons are universally recognized as good
> ones and sometimes they aren't. Sometime the barriers to collaboration
> mean that some things will be done sepereately or not done at all.

What struck (and continues to strike) me most is that people are
surprised they can actually mean something to the project and contribute
their thoughts, ideas and work. 

> For example, Ubuntu founding members have been criticized for not just
> working within the Debian project. For a number of reasons, those that
> made that decision felt strongly that a new project, collaborating
> where possible, was the best decision for everyone involved. I hope
> that time has showed that this was the best choice for everyone but it's
> important to recognize that this issue was, and may still be, very
> contentious with some groups.

I like to believe that Ubuntu became as succesful as it is because of
the goals those founding members wanted/want to achieve. Since these
sometimes conflict with the goals of Debian I don't see how they could
have achieved them while working within the Debian project.

> Of course, in most cases, split efforts are based on a lack of
> information, a lack of transparency, or a set of percieved barriers
> that may not actually exist. In these cases, it's important to
> approach and educate folks and invite them to collaborate. If they
> choose not to, they probably have good reasons -- even if you don't
> share them. My own experience says that by recognizing good work
> wherever it is, and working hard with to bring folks into the fold, we
> all benefit most.

You're absolutely right and to be honest, the Ubuntu community could use
a bit more transparency here and there -- I have some ideas about that
but nothing really useful yet.

> I absolutely understand and empathize with frustration over 
> unnecessary duplication of work. That said, telling people that they are
> not helpful is, very often, not the most helpful way to remedy the
> problem. :)

You are absolutely right, my apologies for being a bit too blunt.
-- 
Dennis K.
  - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntu.com
  - Linux voor iedereen:    http://www.ubuntu-nl.org

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