9w - an installer for old computers
NikTh
nick-athens30 at ubuntu.com
Sun Mar 16 16:13:36 UTC 2014
I will test that, but on VB.
Nice work!
Best Regards
On 03/16/2014 05:29 PM, Nio Wiklund wrote:
> Hi Lubuntu users,
>
> This link (posts #88 and #89) describes a new and polished version of
> the 9w installer and the compressed image files available
>
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2209683&page=5&p=12957586#post12957586
>
> There are updated compressed images with Phill's nonpae kernel.
>
> 1. An ultra-light text only system made from the Ubuntu Trusty beta 1
> mini.iso
>
> dd_TrustyB1npae-text.img.xz
>
> This system runs for me in an IBM Thinkpad T42 with Pentium M with 80 MB
> RAM (set with the boot option mem=80M)
>
> 2. A very light Lubuntu Core system made from the Ubuntu Trusty beta 1
> mini.iso
>
> dd_TrustyB1npae-LubuCore.img.xz
>
> This system is lighter than the previous 'Ltrusty' and runs with 128 MB
> RAM ... as shown by Doug S at the Ubuntu Forums: it runs but needs more
> RAM to do well while surfing the web :-P
>
> -o-
>
> Get the iso files and read the descriptions at
>
> http://phillw.net/isos/linux-tools/9w/
>
> 1_Help-to-run-experimental_9w-installer.txt -> README.txt
> 1477443584 mar 15 13:45 9w_multi-install_trusty-n-saucy.iso
> 439461 mar 7 10:23 GrowIt.pdf
> 343 mar 14 20:39 login-n-password.txt
> 708837376 mar 15 13:22 LubuSaucy-pae2pm-4GB.iso
> 991 mar 15 14:22 md5sums.txt.asc
> 101211 mar 6 17:40 mkUSB-quick-start-manual.pdf
> 4421 mar 13 21:53 README.txt
> 660602880 mar 15 12:44 TrustyB1npae-LubuCore.iso
> 530579456 mar 15 08:49 TrustyB1npae-text.iso
>
> Welcome to test it and report your results in a real computer or in a
> virtual machine and at various levels of CPU horsepower and RAM size!
>
> Best regards
> Nio
>
> 2014-03-14 22:35, Nio Wiklund skrev:
>> Hi Phill,
>>
>> Yes I can. I'll test with standard Lubuntu 32-bit.
>>
>> I guess the priority list should be what is possible with the
>>
>> 1. desktop installer
>>
>> 2. alternate installer
>>
>> and the non-conventional alternatives can be tested with standard
>> Lubuntu and or Lubuntu Core
>>
>> 3. OBI (only booted from mass storage devices, typically USB pendrive)
>>
>> 4. 9w (booted from CD/DVD/USB drives)
>>
>> -o-
>>
>> I was not able to install Lubuntu Saucy with 128 MB RAM and any of the
>> conventional installers. The alternate or mini iso (netboot) installer
>> needed at least 160 MB. I could install with the OBI with 128 MB. I did
>> not try the OBI with less RAM. The text in that page is brief, and I
>> think it should state the limit for each installer. I expect that the
>> limits will be the same or slightly higher with Trusty.
>>
>> Best regards
>> Nio
>>
>> 2014-03-14 21:19, Phill Whiteside skrev:
>>> Hi Nio,
>>>
>>> can you ensure that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#System_Requirements
>>> is up to date.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Phill.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10 March 2014 01:46, Nio Wiklund <nio.wiklund at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:nio.wiklund at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi again!
>>>
>>> A couple of friends at the Ubuntu Forums have helped us find the low
>>> limit of hardware, when Lubuntu Saucy and Trusty can run (as installed
>>> with the 9w installer)
>>>
>>> See this link (posts #76-79)
>>>
>>> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2209683&page=4&p=12952191#post12952191
>>>
>>> Doug S wrote {
>>>
>>> Ventrical @ 166 Mhz and 80 Megabytes is not enough. Me at 200 Mhz and
>>> 115 Megabytes right on the edge, and while installation was fine,
>>> operationally probably not enough.
>>> }
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>> Nio
>>>
>>> 2014-03-08 13:38, Nio Wiklund skrev:
>>> > [my text is at the end except the link]
>>> >
>>> > http://phillw.net/isos/linux-tools/9w/
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > 2014-03-08 12:24, Ali Linx skrev:
>>> >>
>>> >> On 03/08/2014 01:30 AM, Nio Wiklund wrote:
>>> >>> 2014-03-07 01:53, Nio Wiklund skrev:
>>> >>>> Hi,
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> We want to try a new kernel for Trusty Tahr, that is developed by
>>> >>>> PhillW. Many people help to build an Ubuntu based operating system
>>> >>>> around it, a system that should work on most computers (maybe
>>> except
>>> >>>> some of those brand new ones that cannot switch off UEFI).
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> We have a wide variety of computers, but have not found any
>>> really old
>>> >>>> one without PAE capability. I'm not talking about Pentium M and
>>> Celeron
>>> >>>> M, I'm talking about CPUs before Pentium II:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Pentium Pro, Pentium (i586), or Intel 486 or maybe the
>>> corresponding
>>> >>>> generation of AMD from 1993-1997.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> I have an old computer from 1998, and it has a Pentium II CPU
>>> at 400
>>> >>>> MHz, so it must be older. Check for a clock frequency at or
>>> below 200
>>> >>>> MHz.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> If you are a happy owner of such a jewel, please help us test
>>> that the
>>> >>>> non-pae kernel really works in a computer without PAE
>>> capability :-)
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Best regards
>>> >>>> Nio
>>> >>>>
>>> >>> Hi again,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> After some [private] replies offering tests on old enough
>>> hardware, I
>>> >>> can report the following results:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> You can try the installer (to find out if it boots and runs in
>>> text mode
>>> >>> with really low RAM). An older computer might need less RAM for
>>> drivers
>>> >>> than my IBM Thinkpad T42 with Pentium M CPU.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> *The Debian installer, live in an iso file*
>>> >>>
>>> >>> It starts in text mode and uses 18 MB RAM when idle (and 22 MB in a
>>> >>> newer computer with AMD Athlon dual core 4400+), but I have problems
>>> >>> below 64 MB, set with the boot option (text is default)
>>> >>>
>>> >>> mem=48M
>>> >>>
>>> >>> in an old IBM Thinkpad T42 with Pentium M CPU.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> it cannot unpack initramfs
>>> >>>
>>> >>> *Ubuntu Trusty installed system with Phill's non-pae kernel*
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The Ubuntu Trusty kernel needs more RAM, now after some
>>> >>> testing I would say at least 64 MB, but I have problems below 80
>>> MB, set
>>> >>> with the boot options
>>> >>>
>>> >>> text mem=64M
>>> >>>
>>> >>> in the same old IBM Thinkpad T42 with Pentium M CPU.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> When idling
>>> >>>
>>> >>> free -m # shows 38 MB RAM used
>>> >>> htop # shows 39 MB RAM used
>>> >>>
>>> >>> but it seems more RAM is needed at some stage of the boot process.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> -o-
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The really old computers available so far have too low RAM,
>>> except one,
>>> >>> with a Pentium Pro at 200 Mhz. It has 128 Megabytes of memory. The
>>> >>> computer was purchased on 1996.08.31. But it has a PAE flag and
>>> should
>>> >>> be PAE capable.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I'm starting to think, that most computers if not all, that are old
>>> >>> enough to lack PAE capability have too low RAM anyway for our
>>> new Ubuntu
>>> >>> flavour non-pae kernel.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The outstanding exceptions are Celeron M and Pentium M, that
>>> lack the
>>> >>> PAE flag, but in most cases have PAE capability.
>>> >>
>>> >> Further to my previous reply:
>>> >>
>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/lubuntu-users/2014-March/006876.html
>>> >>
>>> >> I have forgotten to mention that on this thread:
>>> >> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1590614
>>> >>
>>> >> I manged to install - trying again to save you the trouble to go
>>> through
>>> >> all the posts of that long thread - Linux on such super old
>>> machine (P2
>>> >> with 64MB RAM and 4GB HDD) by:
>>> >>
>>> >> 1- Taking the HDD out - because the machine itself has nothing to be
>>> >> used to install Linux.
>>> >> 2- Plugged the HDD to another machine.
>>> >> 3- Linux installed - I wasted one month for this experiment
>>> because more
>>> >> than 50 different systems didn't work - check the thread.
>>> >> 4- Disconnected the HDD and put it back in.
>>> >>
>>> >> One month, ladies and gentlemen. Yes, I learned a lot and proved
>>> a lot
>>> >> but the real result wasn't helpful for a daily use. Why? because
>>> these
>>> >> machines can no longer serve while we are in 2014.
>>> >>
>>> >> I was shocked when I managed to connect to the Wireless Network and
>>> >> update the system. But that was the further I managed to go IIRC.
>>> >>
>>> >> See the thread if you wish:
>>> >> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1590614
>>> >>
>>> >> If anyone still think I'm wrong, see the thread :)
>>> >>
>>> >> And first thing you do, check the date of that thread: October
>>> 8th, 2010
>>> >>
>>> >>> Best regards
>>> >>> Nio
>>> >>>
>>> >> Thank you!
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > Hi everybody :-)
>>> >
>>> > I see your points, I just want to explore things and find out myself.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > *. 9w - an installer for old computers
>>> >
>>> > So I uploaded a directory with an experimental installer and two
>>> sample
>>> > systems to install. The installer is based on a Debian system with an
>>> > i486 kernel, and it can install any kind of [free] operating system.
>>> > There are two sample systems which expand to 4 GB
>>> >
>>> > Lubuntu Trusty non-pae built february 23 'Ltrusty-npae-feb23.iso'
>>> > Lubuntu Saucy PAE-for-Pentium-M 'LubuSaucy-pae2pm-4GB.iso'
>>> >
>>> > 9w comes as a hybrid ISO file, that works from CD/DVD and cloned from
>>> > USB. So it is simple to make install media for most old computers.
>>> >
>>> > See this link
>>> >
>>> > http://phillw.net/isos/linux-tools/9w/
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > 1. What computer will run at all, will be able to do some 'real work',
>>> > etc? It might be worth the effort just for the sake of knowledge.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > 2. What computers are the target for a non-pae Ubuntu kernel?
>>> >
>>> > With the new fix in Trusty, [almost all] Pentium M and Celeron M will
>>> > work with standard 32-bit kernel and the very simple tweak to add the
>>> > boot option 'forcepae'.
>>> >
>>> > If all pre-Pentium II computers are out of the question, how many
>>> > computers remain? For example: Are there motherboards, that are
>>> non-pae,
>>> > and are not helped by fake-PAE? Other problems?
>>> >
>>> > I'm thinking of Jörn's reply:
>>> >
>>> > -------- Ursprungligt meddelande --------
>>> > Ämne: Re: have you got a really old computer
>>> > Datum: Fri, 7 Mar 2014 22:48:24 +0100
>>> > Från: Joern <joern.schoenyan at web.de <mailto:joern.schoenyan at web.de>>
>>> > Till: Nio Wiklund <nio.wiklund at gmail.com
>>> <mailto:nio.wiklund at gmail.com>>
>>> >
>>> > There also some CPUs that aren't PAE capable but were likely shipped
>>> > with enough RAM, like some VIA ones, 1 or 2 versions of Pentium M with
>>> > 1.2 GHz and the Transmeta Crusoe.
>>> >
>>> > Jörn
>>> > --------
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > 3. What computers are the target for ToriOS?
>>> >
>>> > - Is Pentium 4 and 512 MB RAM the low limit?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Best regards
>>> > Nio
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw
>>
>
>
--
--https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NikTh--
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