Kubuntu/Ubuntu does not remove everything from memory at shutdown
wayward4now at gmail.com
Sat Mar 13 01:16:29 UTC 2010
On Fri, 2010-03-12 at 11:39 +1100, Steve Morris wrote:
> On 12/03/10 07:11, Isak Enström wrote:
> > On 2010-03-11 20:09, Mark Greenwood wrote:
> >> On Thursday 11 Mar 2010 04:53:21 Howard Coles Jr. wrote:
> >>> On Wednesday 10 March 2010 03:48:35 pm Mark Greenwood wrote:
> >>>> Yes that's exactly what I'm suggesting. Those suggesting this is a Windows
> >>>> problem have missed the point and failed to understand the problem. The
> >>>> problem is that Kubuntu does not correctly shut down and clear
> >>>> memory/microcode/ACPI on a warm reboot. If the system has not been
> >>>> properly shut down then it is not the next OS's problem if hardware does
> >>>> not initialise correctly.
> >>>> Mark
> >>> Here's the deal. The BIOS clears and initializes the hardware to a certain
> >>> point upon boot up, and when the control is handed over to the OS after the
> >>> bootstrap is loaded, it's up to the starting OS to initialize, and load the
> >>> drivers for all detected devices. Blaming Kubuntu because Windoze doesn't
> >>> load right has got to be the craziest thing I've heard around here in a LONG
> >>> time.
> >>> Here's a point you don't get as well: If you're "warm booting", you're by
> >>> nature NOT clearing all the code in all the adapters at the OS level, you're
> >>> just clearing and writing out the Hard Drive cache, killing all the apps
> >>> running, and kicking off a quick reboot via ACPI. It's up to the BIOS of the
> >>> box, or the next OS startup at that point to reset all cards and memory. That
> >>> kind of completely empty RAM and all other add-on cards would be a complete
> >>> cold boot, right? Warm booting means I don't take the time to completely
> >>> clear and shut down the hardware, I just do a "refresh" boot, hence the name
> >>> "warm".
> >>> I've been using Kubuntu for years now, and there have been times when I've had
> >>> to do a cold boot because drivers didn't load successfully, but I've never (on
> >>> many machines) heard of blaming OS3 because OS2 and/or OS1 didn't do their
> >>> shut down right. I've always blamed the OS that was booting up for not
> >>> loading drivers or initializing cards. I've also had to do full power off
> >>> reboots because warm boots don't completely empty RAM/microcode, etc on
> >>> different OSes (Linux, NetWare, OS/2, and Windows) so this is nothing new.
> >>> Sometimes to get new microcode/updates to load, or fully update drivers, you
> >>> had to do a full cold power off reboot, I just haven't run into that in a long
> >>> while.
> >> I'm sure that's all very relevant to something. But here's the deal.
> >> I have Windows Vista, Kubuntu, and Mandriva on my laptop.
> >> I can warm reboot from Windows into any of the 3 OS's I have installed.
> >> I can warm reboot from Mandriva into any of the 3 OS's I have installed.
> >> I cannot warm reboot from Kubuntu into any OS, including Kubuntu.
> >> You still trying to tell me this is Windows' problem?
> >> Mark
> > Maybe you should try to upgrade you BIOS? From your experience it
> > certainly sounds like Kubuntu does things differently, but it coud just
> > as easily be a hardware/BIOS bug. I think it would have been discussed
> > more if no one could warm reboot Kubuntu without error.
> > /Isak
> It is not a bios issue. I have Kubuntu/Ubuntu, Mandriva and Win 7 on the
> one machine that I am tri-booting between. In order to get sound from my
> sound card in Win 7 after using Kubuntu I have to boot Mandriva to kdm
> and reboot to Win 7 from there. This works because Mandriva correctly
> shuts everything down at shutdown whereas Kubuntu attempts to shutdown
> everything that is not in its keep alive lists and obviously doesn't do
> it properly or we wouldn't be having this issue.
> I've even been in the situation of, because of Compiz being unstable and
> randomly crashing with no way of restarting it, of having to warm boot
> Kubuntu with applications like firefox still active, and having the
> starting of firefox in Kubuntu after the reboot tell me it cannot start
> because firefox is already loaded and not responding and to shut that
> instance down first. So the kill everything that other people are
> telling me Kubuntu does is either not being done or does not work properly.
Maybe you drug in gnome, somehow, and KDE isn't shutting it down
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
..the Sin of Ignorance, and the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
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