Moving this thread to Sounder - Re: Howto: Empathy Training, Anger Management for improving communication & assistance in FSW community - was: Re: CiscoLinksys - Ric Moore +=1. Sensible man. ... ; jor kubuntu

[giovanni_re]

Since this thread has been commented by a list admin to be off topic for
this list, as the Original Poster, I invite everyone who wishes to
discuss this further to come over to the Ubuntu Sounder list to do so.

Do you know about the Sounder list?  Everyone should subscribe to that
list.  Really.  :)

"About sounder   
Anything goes Ubuntu community chit-chat and discussion list"
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/sounder


=
Ric Moore - It would be great if you forwarded your reply to my
origianal message to the sounder list, as i mention near the end of this
message.


==
Please do not respond to this message on the KUbuntu list - come on over
to the Sounder list to continue any discussion.

For completeness in this message, below is the message I've posted
there:
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2010-August/015055.html


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==  Join in the Global weekly meetings, via VOIP, about all Free SW HW & Culture
http://sites.google.com/site/berkeleytip/

----- Original message -----
From: "giovanni_re" <john_re at fastmail.us>
To: sounder at lists.ubuntu.com
Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2010 18:58:24 -0700
Subject: Commentary on: Fwd: Howto: Empathy Training, Anger Management
for improving communication & assistance in FSW community  - was: Re:
CiscoLinksys - Ric Moore +=1.       Sensible man. ... ; jor kubuntu

Hi Sounder people.  :)

Here's an email I sent to the KUbuntu list yesterday.  The KU list admin
mentioned this was off topic for that list, so, upon investigation, this
sounder list seems to be the "Anything goes Ubuntu community ..
discussion list", so that seems like where this will be on topic.


==  Parenthetically:
(Personally, I think discussion _about_ a list (KUbuntu) should be on
topic on that list, even if the topic is stated as "This list is for
support questions regarding Kubuntu."

The larger point, which I wish I had the time to write now, but i don't
have the time now, is that specifying "kubuntu-users" that way breaks
social convention - nominally ("by name") the "kubuntu-users" list's
topic _must_ be for _anything_ pertaining in any way to kubuntu users, &
not limited to "support questions".  Properly, support questions should
go to a list called "kubuntu-support".

_Further_, if the KUbuntu community administrators did wish to maintain
their messed-up list naming convention, then they should also create a
"kubuntu-anything" list, which would be like the Sounder list ["Anything
goes Ubuntu community .. discussion list"] but for KUbuntu.)


=  (double parenthetically)
(I have been told that there is in fact a motivating reason that the
(K)Ubuntu _IRC_ channels are supposed to be about support, not general
discussion - cause that is the 1st place users go for support, & it is
less hassle to defy social convention & make the basic named channels
only about support, than to have them be, properly, about anything, &
have to keep telling people "for support, please move over to
'#(k)ubuntu-support'".

I think that is an improper choice, & there are valid reasons for doing
things the standard/typical/proper way around.

I don't know, but I suspect that similar reasoning underlies why the
same situation prevails on the KUbuntu mailing list.

It's so near the low end of my huge todo list that I'll be unlikely to
bring up that topic on some mailing list, along with reasons, in an
effort to get the currently (IMO) bad choice reversed.  But, I encourage
anyone else to do so if you do feel strongly about it.  :)
)


==  History of the message below:
Originally I posted a question about problems getting a Linksys/Cisco
wifi adapter working in KUbuntu 10.4, due likely to messed up networking
in KU 10.4.

CiscoLinksys AE1000 usb wifi N Dual Band adapter on a KUbuntu 10.4 Howto
Thoughts Issues ; jor kubuntu  
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-users/2010-July/051546.html


After someone replied to my message in a somewhat unjustifiably
denigrating tone, on _his_ own, Ric made a useful and, to me
enlightening comment, about how to understand what people say, & how to
reply properly/helpfully.


Thus, my below message was prompted by my thought that Ric Moore had
brought up an interesting & valuable idea, & that the (K)Ubuntu
communities would be well served if he would care to write a howto, or
more, about that topic, & how it pertains to communication in the Free
SW & Ubuntu communities.

Howto: Empathy Training, Anger Management for improving communication &
assistance in FSW community - was: Re: CiscoLinksys - Ric Moore +=1.
Sensible man. ... ; jor kubuntu  
My message, 1) note by moderator offtopic, 2) replies
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-users/2010-August/051584.html  
Ric's reply
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-users/2010-August/051595.html  


==
So, we kubuntu people may have fully discussed this on the ku list, so
maybe we've got nothing more to say about it.  

But, since it is an important topic, _&_ the listadmin said no more
there, I, as the OP, thought it was the proper thing to do to direct
further comments, if anyone wished to make any, over to the sounder list
(because there is no kubuntu-anything list in existence yet.)

Further, maybe the non ku list people here might have some valuable
thoughts.  :)


==  Below is my forwarded message.

I'm going to follow _this_ email (which includes both the original
message & my commentary above), by a forward of _just_ the original
message.  It might be easier to keep things on topic if people only
reply to _this_ message with replies to my comments above, & comments to
my original message only to the forward of that message which I'll send
shortly.

Also, Ric might want to forward his reply to my original message, to the
copy I'm about to forward.

:)


=====================================================================

----- Original message -----
From: "giovanni_re" <john_re at fastmail.us>
To: kubuntu-users at lists.ubuntu.com
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2010 17:58:21 -0700
Subject: Howto: Empathy Training,       Anger Management for improving
communication &  assistance in FSW community  - was: Re: CiscoLinksys -
Ric Moore +=1.   Sensible man. ... ; jor kubuntu

<Snip>

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Thanks for reading.

Please do not respond to this message on the KUbuntu list.

Please subscribe to the Sounder list, if you haven't already, & reply
there if you wish.

Thanks.  :)