[Bug 578045] Re: Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading entire OS

[John Mills]

Hi all,

I completely agree with this bug report, for example, if I started using
Windows XP in 2001 I could still easily install a new build of Firefox,
Open Office, Inkscape etc. But with Ubuntu because the backports are not
great I have to either compile the source myself or look for binaries.
There are not PPAs available for all  application in the repos. As the
above commentator stated Ubuntu 10.04 is approaching 2 years old now.
Why should I be denied the ability to run newer software without
upgrading my operating system? Is this really reasonable?

If I want a new version of Blender I have to move off of an LTS release
to get it or go to the bother of compiling it myself. And it appears to
me non LTS releases are in essence beta versions in testing for the next
LTS.

Come on... be reasonable here. If you want to target new users they will
want newer versions of their favourite software and they will not want
to compile it themselves or hunt around for an unsupported and possibly
insecure PPA.

Most new users are scarred to update/upgrade their machines and risk
braking their working systems. Simple as. This in my humble opinion is
the major failing of Ubuntu and why I can not recommend it to a 'normal'
user who wants a computer system with 'up to date' software that they do
not have to re-install or upgrade every year.

I hope some one with authority can really take a loot at this issue.

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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/578045

Title:
  Upgrading packaged Ubuntu application unreasonably involves upgrading
  entire OS

Status in NULL Project:
  Invalid
Status in Ubuntu Software Center:
  Invalid
Status in “software-center” package in Ubuntu:
  In Progress

Bug description:
  It's hard to imagine that this could be true, but it is easier to
  upgrade to the newest stable versions of popular free and open source
  software (referred to from here on as FOSS) in proprietary operating
  systems, than it is to do so on Ubuntu.

  Two examples:

  1. Wait for a new version of LibreOffice to be released.

  What happens:
  * <http://www.libreoffice.org/download/> offers downloadable versions for Windows, Mac OS X, Ubuntu and other systems.
  * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way.

  2. Wait for a new Hedgewars version to be released. (Or notice that
  you are unable to play network games, because the server requires a
  client version newer than the one packaged in Ubuntu.)

  What happens:
  * <http://hedgewars.org/download.html> links to an Ubuntu package, but this requires setting up an untrusted "Playdeb" channel.
  * On Mac OS X, the new version is advertised by a badge on the App Store icon, and can be installed in a couple of clicks.
  * However, nothing in Ubuntu Software Center, Update Manager, or anywhere in the default system, allows you to install the newest version in a trusted way.

  Users learn that they shouldn't download from outside trusted
  repositories or websites as a rule, and it's very true that choosing
  to install applications from outside trusted places poses a risk to
  the system. PPAs often provide unstable, development releases which
  may not run well on the system they're installed on, or pose security
  risks to the system. GetDeb.net is a reasonably trustable source for
  now, but a new user may not know about it, and it still may not
  provide the same level of trust that an Ubuntu sanctioned source would
  to the user. But if nothing else, GetDeb could be configured as a
  source for new, stable yet unsupported versions of software and be
  advertised as such somewhere in the default Ubuntu install.

  What should happen:
  * On running Ubuntu Software Center or Update Manager, you should be told that you have the option to replace the current version with a newer version.

  WHY THIS SHOULD HAPPEN:

      A rolling release, or semi-rolling release system has been
  suggested in the past and almost always is shot down for various
  reasons. I don't believe the way I'm suggesting this would constitute
  a rolling release system, and I don't think it would require any large
  change to the way things are done now. Ultimately, it would be up to
  the devs to implement this idea in whatever way they wished if they so
  chose, but here's why I think the USC should provide the ability to
  upgrade software easily and safely:

      -Software development stops for no operating system, and Windows
  users are used to having the newest versions of software as soon as,
  or soon after they come out. Being able to upgrade easily to newer
  versions of software, is a rather reasonable expectation of a modern,
  mainstream operating system.

     -Resources wouldn't be stretched too thin; software would be
  upgraded to their newest stable version under the stipulation that
  regardless of their former status of support (main or universe), they
  may or will be completely unsupported after upgrade. It's better than
  or at least equal to the alternative; using potentially malicious or
  unstable untrusted software from unofficial sources.

     -Doesn't it seem wrong that it's easier to have the newest versions
  of FOSS software on proprietary operating systems than on a largely
  FOSS one? Ubuntu should showcase the best and newest of what FOSS has
  to offer, not so much or in a way that makes it look like a Debian-
  based Fedora, but in a way that if the user wants it, he can get it
  easily. Sure, you could reasonably argue that if the user cares so
  much about new software, he/she could go to a distro like Fedora or a
  rolling release distro, but that'd be kinda like Windows telling it's
  users that if they want the newest version of say, Windows Media
  Player (bear with me here xD) they have to upgrade their entire OS to
  an unstable development release. Ubuntu should be able to offer new
  versions of software easily, but it doesn't mean that all the core
  system libraries and daemons have to be upgraded. Simply an option for
  (at least) commonly used software.

  ------------

  Latest progress:
  * <https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui> (for software in the Ubuntu archive)
  * <http://voices.canonical.com/isd/?p=167> (for software not in the Ubuntu archive)

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